Xim on PC using MKB for the aim assist?

[unknow451804]

Is it possible to use Xim apex/Xim 4 or any other converter to use MKB being recognized as a controller input on PC just to get the aim assist on MKB? I want to even the disavantage on close combat in games such as warzone and apex legends, because right now the AA is so strong that im reconsidering going back to controller after years (but I really don't want to, because I got used to MKB).

Any help or recommendation?

[Brutalimp]

Aim assist with the mouse can sometimes make aiming harder because your aim slows down and you lose the ability to make fine adjustments within the aim assist bubble.

Some play with it on, some off.

[ceebs]

As brutalimp says, AA on PC can be a curse as well as a blessing. Because aim assist causes your sensitivity to drop as you get on target, you’ll find it harder aiming at players running or flying horizontally away from you than you would with a controller. If the enemy is good at strafing they’re harder to hit with a mouse with AA than they are without it. And don’t forget that you’re limited by the XIM’s flashing red lights as your mouse movement is based on distance, not velocity, when translated as controller input.
Having said all that, you will get the same aim assist that you do on console, as well as all the other advantages that you get when gaming on PC, so if you’re OK with the downsides, then you can take advantage of AA on PC.

[Anavarz]

I don't agree with brutallimo at all

And I've noticed for years now nobody talks about xim apex on PC at first I was fully against it cause I'm a PC player.  Now I just don't care because of this xim nexus controller on its way. 

But let's be honest here.  If half this community realised how crazy xim apex is on pc running it at 1000hz while playing cod at 240+FPS  I can GUARANTEE  most people on this forum would sell their consoles and buy a PC

XIM APEX ON PC IS SO @#$% OP it's not even funny..

All you do on COD is put your aim assist setting on Standard .and you become a walking aim bot.  I don't have any problems with sticky aim assist on PC, my aim is snappy and consistent all the time. 

[Brutalimp]

Regular mouse aim is just as OP if you got good aim, except you don’t get an aim bubble around enemy characters that messes up your muscle memory.

Perhaps if your aim is bad to begin with or you got Parkinsons or something, xim apex may help you on PC. If you got good aim, I don’t see the point. If anything it’s a crutch that will actually hinder your future aim potential.

If it was that amazing, we WOULD all be talking about it and previous xim users like
drLupo would be using it instead of transitioning back to a mouse.

[Thomasthetankengine]

My impression is that Xim has been a grey area in terms of cheating because it offers console users who prefer MnK a workaround when the devs don’t offer native support.
But using a Xim in a PC game where native MnK is the default input is just plain cheating, no? How is it different than downloading a soft aim bot?

[ceebs]

Because XIM can’t auto aim for you, any more than a controller can.

If you want your reticle to slow down as you get on target then that’s what you’ll get, as the mouse just emulates what you get with a controller, when connected to a XIM. But those players who are used to PC don’t want this desensitisation. They’re used to putting the cursor on target and don’t need any help from AA. Those who want to abuse aim assist are generally console players coming over to mouse aiming, who are used to it on controller.

[skullhead]

Now I'm using xim apex on pc and my xbox sx controller.

I want to aim assist like the video below.

Do I have to buy more mods or buy a console?

In fact, the problem of consoles in my country zone is not very popular.

or do i have to buy console and find friends to play on pc

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H90AKo0w_48&ab_channel=Clix

[Santigold]

I don't agree with brutallimo at all

And I've noticed for years now nobody talks about xim apex on PC at first I was fully against it cause I'm a PC player.  Now I just don't care because of this xim nexus controller on its way. 

But let's be honest here.  If half this community realised how crazy xim apex is on pc running it at 1000hz while playing cod at 240+FPS  I can GUARANTEE  most people on this forum would sell their consoles and buy a PC

XIM APEX ON PC IS SO @#$% OP it's not even funny..

All you do on COD is put your aim assist setting on Standard .and you become a walking aim bot.  I don't have any problems with sticky aim assist on PC, my aim is snappy and consistent all the time.

Actually I can comment on that, since Ive used XIM Apex on PC extensively in the last year or so playing COD.

Essentially- I am now considering switching back to native keyboard and mouse input.

The issue is that once you become a good player and can aim very well with the mouse, the xim starts to become a ceiling that hinders you to improve to higher levels.

And to be clear- I dont think it's necessarily the XIM's fault, but more the technical limitations of controller look mechanics and how the aiming with the controller works. Mainly the turn speed limit is the biggest issue as well as lack of "perfect" precision. And this limitation gets more noticeable and pronounced the higher the FPS is in the game using high refresh rate monitors like 240 Hz and above. It wasnt that noticeable back when games ran at 60 fps, because even on PC, playing FPS games at 60fps and on 60 Hz monitors- the mouse aiming feels like sh!t. This is why some people would use terms like xim feeling 1:1 as PC, in reality it is nowhere close to native 1:1 PC aim, which again, becomes more evident, when you play at high frames per second + high refresh rate monitor.

I will show you a very good example of what I mean exactly in a video from Nate Gibson who is a very good keyboard and mouse player on PC further in the post.

See- it is technically impossible to "translate" controller aiming mechanic to mouse and keyboard so that it is as fast and precise as native mouse and keyboard on PC. Controller aiming is based on velocity and time (how long the stick is held in a certain position). That's absolutely sh!t when we speak about perfect aiming mechanics. That is the reason why over 90% of FPS games on consoles have aim assist with controller. Because otherwise (if they didnt use aim assist) with fast moving characters and sh!itty sub par aiming mechanics nobody would be able to stay on a target that is strafing really fast, or sliding really fast etc. It would be an absolutely frustrating experience for most ppl who play with a controller.

When I used the XIM Apex on PC on high refresh rate monitor and 200+ fps, it felt really mushy / floaty compared to native keyboard and mouse. It lacks turn speed and precision. Additionally, it feels like it takes a few milliseconds for the xim to reach the max turn speed when aiming, feels like it gradually becomes faster until it reaches the full turn speed. Now yes, there are advanced settings in the XIM Apex manager like "boost" and whatnot, but those arent really a solution, because as the downside the slower movements of the mouse start to feel "off" and whatnot when you use "boost". It is just a "bandage" solution to try and fix a trashy controller aiming mechanic.

Also the input translation wasnt consistent, for example exactly same movement of the mouse would look different on the screen as if you had a mouse with a cheap sensor that is not sending the mouse coordinates correctly to the game. Theres inconsistency with the xim. And once again it is for the most part due to limits that controller input has, mainly because of the turn speed limit it ends up feeling unprecise.

These Smart Translators attempt to correct all the sh!t that is wrong with controller input mechanics, like acceleration, dead zone limits and weird dead zone shapes, mismatch in X/Y speed ratio etc. and even with the very advanced methods that xim is using, it is technically impossible to achieve the same speed and precision as native mouse aiming on PC.


Now let me show you the video Ive mentioned above:

https://youtu.be/hjB1GhY5sbs?t=80

Look at how fast and how precise Nate Gibson is aiming in that whole video. I can remotely aim as fast and precise with native mouse and keyboard. But with the XIM aiming like this is just impossible. It doesnt matter how talented someone is with the xim- this type of super fast and precise aiming is technically impossible with the XIM or the controller.

By the time you can flick aim on 2 or even 3 different people and kill them with native keyboard and mouse, using the xim you can only manage to flick aim on 1 person. Once again, on super high ingame FPS + using a high refresh monitor, you can feel quite significantly, how mushy and floaty the xim aiming feels compared to native mouse and keyboard.

I am actually even starting to think that on higher skill level of gaming, using the actual controller is superior to using xim with mouse and keyboard and that is because the look mechanics are designed for the controller itself and work best with a controller. You dont emulate or "translate" anything, it is just the raw controller input without any smart translators in between trying to emulate a different input method or anything like that. The aim assist also works best with a controller, because it was designed and tested using the controller.

Im not even joking, I think at high skill levels, like COD pro players and pro streamers, the controller with extended right thumbstick ala "Kontrolfreek" is far superior to using xim with mouse and keyboard. Thats also the reason why I think the new XIM controller has a large potential to become a game changer for players who prefer controller over keyboard and mouse.

Only reason why I kept going back to using XIM on PC was because I am also using Titan 2 with scripts, but if I can find the scripts I need for native mouse and keyboard I will most likely switch to native KB&M.

[Anavarz]

I don't agree with brutallimo at all

And I've noticed for years now nobody talks about xim apex on PC at first I was fully against it cause I'm a PC player.  Now I just don't care because of this xim nexus controller on its way. 

But let's be honest here.  If half this community realised how crazy xim apex is on pc running it at 1000hz while playing cod at 240+FPS  I can GUARANTEE  most people on this forum would sell their consoles and buy a PC

XIM APEX ON PC IS SO @#$% OP it's not even funny..

All you do on COD is put your aim assist setting on Standard .and you become a walking aim bot.  I don't have any problems with sticky aim assist on PC, my aim is snappy and consistent all the time.

Actually I can comment on that, since Ive used XIM Apex on PC extensively in the last year or so playing COD.

Essentially- I am now considering switching back to native keyboard and mouse input.

The issue is that once you become a good player and can aim very well with the mouse, the xim starts to become a ceiling that hinders you to improve to higher levels.

And to be clear- I dont think it's necessarily the XIM's fault, but more the technical limitations of controller look mechanics and how the aiming with the controller works. Mainly the turn speed limit is the biggest issue as well as lack of "perfect" precision. And this limitation gets more noticeable and pronounced the higher the FPS is in the game using high refresh rate monitors like 240 Hz and above. It wasnt that noticeable back when games ran at 60 fps, because even on PC, playing FPS games at 60fps and on 60 Hz monitors- the mouse aiming feels like sh!t. This is why some people would use terms like xim feeling 1:1 as PC, in reality it is nowhere close to native 1:1 PC aim, which again, becomes more evident, when you play at high frames per second + high refresh rate monitor.

I will show you a very good example of what I mean exactly in a video from Nate Gibson who is a very good keyboard and mouse player on PC further in the post.

See- it is technically impossible to "translate" controller aiming mechanic to mouse and keyboard so that it is as fast and precise as native mouse and keyboard on PC. Controller aiming is based on velocity and time (how long the stick is held in a certain position). That's absolutely sh!t when we speak about perfect aiming mechanics. That is the reason why over 90% of FPS games on consoles have aim assist with controller. Because otherwise (if they didnt use aim assist) with fast moving characters and sh!itty sub par aiming mechanics nobody would be able to stay on a target that is strafing really fast, or sliding really fast etc. It would be an absolutely frustrating experience for most ppl who play with a controller.

When I used the XIM Apex on PC on high refresh rate monitor and 200+ fps, it felt really mushy / floaty compared to native keyboard and mouse. It lacks turn speed and precision. Additionally, it feels like it takes a few milliseconds for the xim to reach the max turn speed when aiming, feels like it gradually becomes faster until it reaches the full turn speed. Now yes, there are advanced settings in the XIM Apex manager like "boost" and whatnot, but those arent really a solution, because as the downside the slower movements of the mouse start to feel "off" and whatnot when you use "boost". It is just a "bandage" solution to try and fix a trashy controller aiming mechanic.

Also the input translation wasnt consistent, for example exactly same movement of the mouse would look different on the screen as if you had a mouse with a cheap sensor that is not sending the mouse coordinates correctly to the game. Theres inconsistency with the xim. And once again it is for the most part due to limits that controller input has, mainly because of the turn speed limit it ends up feeling unprecise.

These Smart Translators attempt to correct all the sh!t that is wrong with controller input mechanics, like acceleration, dead zone limits and weird dead zone shapes, mismatch in X/Y speed ratio etc. and even with the very advanced methods that xim is using, it is technically impossible to achieve the same speed and precision as native mouse aiming on PC.


Now let me show you the video Ive mentioned above:

https://youtu.be/hjB1GhY5sbs?t=80

Look at how fast and how precise Nate Gibson is aiming in that whole video. I can remotely aim as fast and precise with native mouse and keyboard. But with the XIM aiming like this is just impossible. It doesnt matter how talented someone is with the xim- this type of super fast and precise aiming is technically impossible with the XIM or the controller.

By the time you can flick aim on 2 or even 3 different people and kill them with native keyboard and mouse, using the xim you can only manage to flick aim on 1 person. Once again, on super high ingame FPS + using a high refresh monitor, you can feel quite significantly, how mushy and floaty the xim aiming feels compared to native mouse and keyboard.

I am actually even starting to think that on higher skill level of gaming, using the actual controller is superior to using xim with mouse and keyboard and that is because the look mechanics are designed for the controller itself and work best with a controller. You dont emulate or "translate" anything, it is just the raw controller input without any smart translators in between trying to emulate a different input method or anything like that. The aim assist also works best with a controller, because it was designed and tested using the controller.

Im not even joking, I think at high skill levels, like COD pro players and pro streamers, the controller with extended right thumbstick ala "Kontrolfreek" is far superior to using xim with mouse and keyboard. Thats also the reason why I think the new XIM controller has a large potential to become a game changer for players who prefer controller over keyboard and mouse.

Only reason why I kept going back to using XIM on PC was because I am also using Titan 2 with scripts, but if I can find the scripts I need for native mouse and keyboard I will most likely switch to native KB&M.

Lol I'll be honest I have also been using titan two scripts with the apex on PC lol I actually feel sad even admitting to it lol. 

But I don't feel like I have mushy aim at all on PC with the apex.  But I only play cod.  And the only config I use for all cods is the infinite warfare config 😂.  I don't know why it just always feels amazing for me

[ShaneN.]

I don't agree with brutallimo at all

And I've noticed for years now nobody talks about xim apex on PC at first I was fully against it cause I'm a PC player.  Now I just don't care because of this xim nexus controller on its way. 

But let's be honest here.  If half this community realised how crazy xim apex is on pc running it at 1000hz while playing cod at 240+FPS  I can GUARANTEE  most people on this forum would sell their consoles and buy a PC

XIM APEX ON PC IS SO @#$% OP it's not even funny..

All you do on COD is put your aim assist setting on Standard .and you become a walking aim bot.  I don't have any problems with sticky aim assist on PC, my aim is snappy and consistent all the time.

And to be clear- I dont think it's necessarily the XIM's fault, but more the technical limitations of controller look mechanics and how the aiming with the controller works. Mainly the turn speed limit is the biggest issue as well as lack of "perfect" precision.

..........

I will show you a very good example of what I mean exactly in a video from Nate Gibson who is a very good keyboard and mouse player on PC further in the post.

......

Also the input translation wasnt consistent, for example exactly same movement of the mouse would look different on the screen as if you had a mouse with a cheap sensor that is not sending the mouse coordinates correctly to the game. Theres inconsistency with the xim. And once again it is for the most part due to limits that controller input has, mainly because of the turn speed limit it ends up feeling unprecise.



Now let me show you the video Ive mentioned above:

https://youtu.be/hjB1GhY5sbs?t=80

Look at how fast and how precise Nate Gibson is aiming in that whole video. I can remotely aim as fast and precise with native mouse and keyboard. But with the XIM aiming like this is just impossible. It doesnt matter how talented someone is with the xim- this type of super fast and precise aiming is technically impossible with the XIM or the controller.

I've been watching a lot of "symfhuny" playing warzone and what I just quoted above from you is exactly how I'm starting to feel just by watching him and others on kb/m.  Even playing some gunfight with guys on console using kb/m, when I'm dead I can spectate my teammate and see how I could never aim around that fast.  I'm almost at the point where I feel like it's holding me back, but at the same time I'm not sure having kb/m directly into series x actually performs as well/smooth/flawlessly as it would on PC.  That and I can't imagine having to learn how to do a action in the game with a separate key for everything, where as right now I'm used to how a button will do several functions.   It would take a lot of setting up in settings and muscle memory to remember what to do in certain situation.  For example, for me right now crouching and laying down are on the same button.   The max turn speed is likely the bigger limitation for me.  Your video is a good example.

Another thing I notice is recoil is kind of hard to control with aim assist on it seems, it feels like it's fighting me when I pull down. Normally ads'ing I can pull down at a normal rate but when locked on a player trying to pull down to lower the reticle when recoil is sending it upwards, I have to swipe down pretty hard/far to get it to come down.  Same thing goes with tracking a guy in a helicopter across the sky.

[Santigold]

I've been watching a lot of "symfhuny" playing warzone and what I just quoted above from you is exactly how I'm starting to feel just by watching him and others on kb/m.  Even playing some gunfight with guys on console using kb/m, when I'm dead I can spectate my teammate and see how I could never aim around that fast.  I'm almost at the point where I feel like it's holding me back, but at the same time I'm not sure having kb/m directly into series x actually performs as well/smooth/flawlessly as it would on PC.  That and I can't imagine having to learn how to do a action in the game with a separate key for everything, where as right now I'm used to how a button will do several functions.   It would take a lot of setting up in settings and muscle memory to remember what to do in certain situation.  For example, for me right now crouching and laying down are on the same button.   The max turn speed is likely the bigger limitation for me.  Your video is a good example.

Another thing I notice is recoil is kind of hard to control with aim assist on it seems, it feels like it's fighting me when I pull down. Normally ads'ing I can pull down at a normal rate but when locked on a player trying to pull down to lower the reticle when recoil is sending it upwards, I have to swipe down pretty hard/far to get it to come down.  Same thing goes with tracking a guy in a helicopter across the sky.

Yeah ppl like symfhuny, NateGibson, ExoGhost (this guy www.youtube.com/watch?v=HhPJ4ELdF9A) and many other very good aimers - the speed and precision of how the aim with native mouse and keyboard on PC, this is absolutely technically impossible to achieve with the XIM or any other controller-to-mouse adapter in general.

..and I can't imagine having to learn how to do a action in the game with a separate key for everything. For example, for me right now crouching and laying down are on the same button.

Yes, this is actually the only button on the controller that has different functions and that was the first thing as well I wanted to have back when using native keyboard and mouse. Luckily- in every recent COD there is a setting to assign crouch+prone to 1 key on the keyboard. This is what I prefer as well, rather than having a separate button for crouch and going prone.

I didn't try native KB&M on Xbox Series X (I do own it though), but on PS5 native mouse and keyboard feels exactly the same as PC, maybe just slightly higher input lag, but other than that it feels the same as PC, PS5 also supports 1000 Hz for Keyboard and Mouse.

However I would recommend using native keyboard and mouse on ps5 or Xbox Series X if you have a 4k 120 Hz monitor. I do have a 4k 120 Hz monitor (Gigabyte M28U) and it is a very good monitor I can fully recommend it. The firmware should be update to the latest one though, because it reduces input lag on the monitor. After the update it is one of the best bang for the buck 4K 144Hz monitors.

The problem with the Xbox Series X is again, it definitely has higher input lag in the operating system itself compared to the PS5. The input feels more delayed than PS5. It was the same on the Xbox One X vs PS4 Pro. It didnt change unfortunately with the new gen. And when "VRR" is enabled on the Xbox Series X it further increases the input lag, quite significantly. So I would recommend nobody ever enable "VRR", because it is trash and adds significant input lag on top of the already existing lag. I double checked this behaviour on my LG Oled TV and the M28U monitor and it added significant input lag on both the TV and monitor.

but at the same time I'm not sure having kb/m directly into series x actually performs as well/smooth/flawlessly as it would on PC.

For the Xbox Series X I can only speak about Warzone- Ive installed Warzone recently like 1-2 weeks ago, cause I wanted to test the 4K 120 fps mode in Warzone. I wanted to compare the 4K 120 fps mode on Xbox Series X vs PS5.

What Ive noticed is- on XSX Warzone in 4K 120fps mode looks much sharper than the PS5 version at 4K 120fps. It seems to run at much higher resolution, the ps5 version is noticeably blurrier, however there is a downside on XSX. The problem on XSX is the framerate- it is very stuttery in 4K 120fps mode, it feels like it runs at around 80-90fps on average. On PS5 the resolution is much lower, but the frametime is more smooth, it has less framerate drops on PS5 and it feels better optimized for 120fps mode on PS5.

Another thing I notice is recoil is kind of hard to control with aim assist on it seems, it feels like it's fighting me when I pull down. Normally ads'ing I can pull down at a normal rate but when locked on a player trying to pull down to lower the reticle when recoil is sending it upwards, I have to swipe down pretty hard/far to get it to come down.

Yes I do notice it as well and it is not surprising, because when you are aiming right on target inside the AA bubble, the aim asist lowers your aiming sensitivity. Thats normal behavior. I remember in some older CODs you could enable or disable aim slowdown and aim rotational assist separately. I think aim rotation assist would be the ideal way to play with the xim, with the aim slowdown disabled. But it also depends on the persons skill.

I mean you can give it a try with native KB & M in bot matches or something like that. The most important thing is to lower the ADS speed and adjust it perfectly so that you are fast but still precise with the aiming. If you adjust both Hip and Ads mouse sensitivity perfectly with native kb & m, you wont miss aim assist.

When you play with native KB & M at high refresh monitors and high ingame FPS, it feels like the arm is connected to the monitor directly and everything is super fast and precise. You never get this feeling with XIM, main reason for that is turn speed limit and the principle of how controller input works, that is based on velocity and time (how long you hold the stick in a certain position). They have to use acceleration with controller input, because otherwise its just uncontrollable. This is why the XIM also gradually reaches its full turn speed when you flick your mouse really fast.

One quick personal oppinion about ExoGhost (this guy www.youtube.com/watch?v=HhPJ4ELdF9A), cause I see many ppl accuse him of using hacks. I really dont know this guy or anything like that, but I think that his aim is legit. He is just playing on a very high refresh rate monitor with high ingame FPS and obviously has good aiming skill. His frags in the videos come off much "crazier" than they really are, because the youtube videos are limited to 60 fps. In reality, when you play on 240 fps and 240 hz monitor (or above that), you basically have 4x the ammount of information (in terms of updates of playermodels per second) when compared to 60fps that we see on youtube. The things look much smoother on 240 Hz monitors running games at 240 fps. So basically my personal oppinion is that what this guy does indeed seems very achievable if someone is a high skilled fps player and good at aiming.

[Santigold]

Lol I'll be honest I have also been using titan two scripts with the apex on PC lol I actually feel sad even admitting to it lol. 

But I don't feel like I have mushy aim at all on PC with the apex.  But I only play cod.  And the only config I use for all cods is the infinite warfare config .  I don't know why it just always feels amazing for me

Honestly dude I dont think anyone should feel sad admitting that they are using scripts, let alone feeld bad for using them.
With the SBMM- the type of people I get matched against, I think at least half of them are using scripts. One good example is slide canceling. If you do it manually with the controller, there is absolutely no way that anyone can hit the perfect slide cancels each and every time without exception. You will just naturally fck up the slide cancels due to bad timing when trying to do it manually, especially with the controller.

Yet in my matches I play against people who hit a perfect slide cancel 100 out of 100 times- that is only possible with scripts.

Also if I researched correctly, it is possible to use scripts with native KB & M with Titan 2. So I will reasearch it further and then see if it works just as good as using the scripts via XIM input.

Again with SBMM, the type of ppl I usually get matched against, alot of them use scripts anyways. Thats how competitive players usually are, they will use all things that are in the "grey zone" to gain a slight advantage over other players. I see no reason why I should not use it myself or feel bad about using it. If SBMM is going to match me against competitive tryhard players, Im gonna have to make sure I am on an even playing field so to speak.

One would be a complete moron to try and play without any "enhancing tools" against people who do use them and have a significant advantage in many situations. And since we are not playing in tournaments for money and other prizes, at the end of the day there is no reason to try and play 100% clean.

Having said all that- I would never use artificial aiming assistance like aimbots or things like wallhacks. It would make gaming boring to me, I would lose interest very quickly, when something artificial is basically playing for me. Imagine someone who has a hobby of Rallye Car driving. The whole thrill in it is to learn how to control the car yourself perfectly in difficult situations. Now lets say some artificial program inside the car would do 70% of the controlling of your can in most difficult situations and you do the rest 30% of controlling- that is boring and unchallenging. Most rallye car fanatics wouldnt want to drive like that.

[Oskool]

I enjoyed reading about your experience with XIM, Santigold. I plan on buying a XIM and ps5 this Christmas if I can find them.

Have you tried XIM on ps5 using remote play?

[antithesis]

Also if I researched correctly, it is possible to use scripts with native KB & M with Titan 2. So I will reasearch it further and then see if it works just as good as using the scripts via XIM input.

True. Connect the m/kb to Titan Two, set the Output Protocol to Multi Interface USB Passthrough, add the mouse and kb calls to a script and go nuts.

Having said all that- I would never use artificial aiming assistance like aimbots or things like wallhacks.

Agreed. Aimbots and wallhacks are bad for gaming. Titan Two offers Computer Vision and one guy did try to make an aimbot with it, against my strong advice not to do it. Activision smacked him down hard and the project went arse up.