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Ran XIM for years; now back to PC & not used to some button mappings. Thoughts?  (Read 1258 times)

Offline KJabs

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Has anyone else switched from XIM back to PC with native keyboard/mouse?
The issue that I'm running into is some button mappings in COD Warzone.

There's some commands that are press the button for one function, hold for another.
Then there's one command that you use two buttons at once to activate it.
PC makes these things separate buttons (no more combos or holding).  Has anyone else experienced this?

Obviously I can buy a bigger gamepad and a mouse with more buttons, which I may have to do.
The rest is just going to be retraining my muscle memory, I guess?
« Last Edit: 09:32 PM - 09/20/21 by KJabs »
- KJabs
-Xbox Series X (at MSRP from Best Buy!) using Xbox One Controller and XIM4
-Xbox One Day One Edition (Retired) and XIM4
-Xbox 360 with XIM3 (Retired)
-------------
-XIM4: $125
-XIM3: $150
-Improved COD K/D: PRICELESS.
-------------
Current New as of 2021-09:
Razer Tartarus V2
New Razer or Logitech Mouse TBD
Retired as of 2021-09:
Belkin Nostromo n52
Logitech G9x

Online antithesis

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I struggle with this too - I far prefer the compact controls of a controller over native PC m/kb.

One option is to use a keyboard that supports variable-depth keybinds like a Wooting. So things like tap vs hold can be bound to the one key. Multiple actions can also be bound to the one key.

Another possibility is an app like reWASD. You should be able to perform similar bindings, but I haven't dug too far into it for that purpose.

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Offline AMG

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Stay on track,

Find out benefits of having a key for each action instead of weird inputs to compensate limited buttons availability.

Offline KJabs

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I struggle with this too - I far prefer the compact controls of a controller over native PC m/kb.

One option is to use a keyboard that supports variable-depth keybinds like a Wooting. So things like tap vs hold can be bound to the one key. Multiple actions can also be bound to the one key.

Another possibility is an app like reWASD. You should be able to perform similar bindings, but I haven't dug too far into it for that purpose.

I don't want any of those optical analog switches like Razer offers.  In fact, I just got a new Tartarus V2 mechamembrane instead of the Pro because I didn't want to deal with that lol.
- KJabs
-Xbox Series X (at MSRP from Best Buy!) using Xbox One Controller and XIM4
-Xbox One Day One Edition (Retired) and XIM4
-Xbox 360 with XIM3 (Retired)
-------------
-XIM4: $125
-XIM3: $150
-Improved COD K/D: PRICELESS.
-------------
Current New as of 2021-09:
Razer Tartarus V2
New Razer or Logitech Mouse TBD
Retired as of 2021-09:
Belkin Nostromo n52
Logitech G9x

Offline KJabs

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Stay on track,

Find out benefits of having a key for each action instead of weird inputs to compensate limited buttons availability.

This is probably the encouragement I needed lol.  I just didn't feel like buying a new mouse when my old Logitech G9x still works great... but it's only 5 buttons.  Time to upgrade and re-train the muscles.
- KJabs
-Xbox Series X (at MSRP from Best Buy!) using Xbox One Controller and XIM4
-Xbox One Day One Edition (Retired) and XIM4
-Xbox 360 with XIM3 (Retired)
-------------
-XIM4: $125
-XIM3: $150
-Improved COD K/D: PRICELESS.
-------------
Current New as of 2021-09:
Razer Tartarus V2
New Razer or Logitech Mouse TBD
Retired as of 2021-09:
Belkin Nostromo n52
Logitech G9x

Offline AgentSmith

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KJabs:
I so understand what you're going through.

I often feel like if there was no X key on the Xbox controller no game would work, it seems like X does everything,
X to Reload
X to pick up weapons from the ground
X to open doors

The only combo I do like, is using the same button/key  for crouch and prone,   Even games on PC that don't have that function I tend to write a macro to allow it on my G13 and assign it to the key I want.

Offline KJabs

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KJabs:
I so understand what you're going through.

...

The only combo I do like, is using the same button/key  for crouch and prone,   Even games on PC that don't have that function I tend to write a macro to allow it on my G13 and assign it to the key I want.

Yes, I'm currently trying to get the crouch-to-prone binding to work properly.  There's a mechanism in the menu for it, but I apparently haven't set it up properly lol.  Just another thing I'm struggling with.  There's a few kinks I still need to work out.
- KJabs
-Xbox Series X (at MSRP from Best Buy!) using Xbox One Controller and XIM4
-Xbox One Day One Edition (Retired) and XIM4
-Xbox 360 with XIM3 (Retired)
-------------
-XIM4: $125
-XIM3: $150
-Improved COD K/D: PRICELESS.
-------------
Current New as of 2021-09:
Razer Tartarus V2
New Razer or Logitech Mouse TBD
Retired as of 2021-09:
Belkin Nostromo n52
Logitech G9x

Offline ShaneN.

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This is something that is stopping me from even trying to run the mouse and keyboard directly to the series x, as I feel like I'd have the same issue.  After @#$% well near 10 years of cod on a xim, I'm really reluctant to even tackle it.

Offline KJabs

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This is something that is stopping me from even trying to run the mouse and keyboard directly to the series x, as I feel like I'd have the same issue.  After @#$% well near 10 years of cod on a xim, I'm really reluctant to even tackle it.

Mousing is slightly better direct.  Maybe I never got mine fully dialed in properly, I dunno, but it's just smoother direct.  Everything else is a learning curve and new muscle memory.
- KJabs
-Xbox Series X (at MSRP from Best Buy!) using Xbox One Controller and XIM4
-Xbox One Day One Edition (Retired) and XIM4
-Xbox 360 with XIM3 (Retired)
-------------
-XIM4: $125
-XIM3: $150
-Improved COD K/D: PRICELESS.
-------------
Current New as of 2021-09:
Razer Tartarus V2
New Razer or Logitech Mouse TBD
Retired as of 2021-09:
Belkin Nostromo n52
Logitech G9x

Offline AgentSmith

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Quote
Mousing is slightly better direct.  Maybe I never got mine fully dialed in properly, I dunno, but it's just smoother direct.  Everything else is a learning curve and new muscle memory.

Direct has no turn speed restrictions

Offline TurboMan

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There is of course the argument that a lot of the top Warzone players agree that controller players have the advantage over native MKB players thanks to how ridiculously strong and fast-acting the AA is on modern CoD titles, and using a XIM is arguably better than using a controller - so maybe direct mouse input isn't even superior. There are pros and cons to both AA abuse and native, if you're forcing yourself to learn native input because you think it will improve your results, then just know it may not have that effect.

Offline AgentSmith

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Direct input ( Native mouse ) forces the user to learn how to aim, how to flick, how to control the mouse to improve hand eye coordination. It's forced because there is no help, aid, or assistance.

In short range the mouse looses out to the controller due to mouse having end of travel, That is both Native and Xim mouse.

But as Native ( with a speedy Sense ) allows faster turn speed it, should loose out in close quarters to a native controller less than a Xim mouse which is limited to the turn speed of the controller and has end of travel.

Quote
if you're forcing yourself to learn native input because you think it will improve your results, then just know it may not have that effect.

Absolutely true, but.. forcing yourself to learn native will improve your actual mouse control, aim assist abuse will never do that, but it will give you a false impression that you are good with a mouse.


Offline TurboMan

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Direct input ( Native mouse ) forces the user to learn how to aim, how to flick, how to control the mouse to improve hand eye coordination. It's forced because there is no help, aid, or assistance.

In short range the mouse looses out to the controller due to mouse having end of travel, That is both Native and Xim mouse.

But as Native ( with a speedy Sense ) allows faster turn speed it, should loose out in close quarters to a native controller less than a Xim mouse which is limited to the turn speed of the controller and has end of travel.

Absolutely true, but.. forcing yourself to learn native will improve your actual mouse control, aim assist abuse will never do that, but it will give you a false impression that you are good with a mouse.

It's much more a case of the mouse losing to the controller at close range because the auto-tracking of the aim assist reacts to enemy movement quicker than any human possibly could. Mousepad space issues are rarely the problem in a one on one fight unless you happen to be in a situation where you were already at the edge of your pad when you run into an enemy and need to turn further in that direction, which happens from time to time but overall is rare unless you're running a very low sens. We of course get that same tracking assistance with a XIM, so that disadvantage is not there, unlike native mouse where there is no aim assist at all.

Sure playing native would better improve your aiming skills, but again, you're still putting yourself at a disadvantage in some games (modern CoDs again being a prime example) so on the whole, is it worth it when the majority go for results over a feeling of their aim being all them? You could always do a combination of both - carry on with your XIM during regular play, and maybe in your spare time tune up your aim on native on Aimlabs or something similar or even practice on bots with aim assist turned off in your spare time.

I'd say you only really need to practice native and flick shots etc. if you plan on moving to native full time, which personally I have no desire to do unless controller aim assist is reduced in future titles, and I don't see that happening at all and it'll probably continue to become stronger. Since AA continues to become stronger and the controller aim assist advantage over mouse continues to become bigger, in my eyes the XIM is becoming a must for taking on controller players if you're playing with a mouse.
« Last Edit: 07:18 AM - 09/24/21 by ZOMBIES! »

Offline KJabs

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There is of course the argument that a lot of the top Warzone players agree that controller players have the advantage over native MKB players thanks to how ridiculously strong and fast-acting the AA is on modern CoD titles, and using a XIM is arguably better than using a controller - so maybe direct mouse input isn't even superior. There are pros and cons to both AA abuse and native, if you're forcing yourself to learn native input because you think it will improve your results, then just know it may not have that effect.

Do you play with Auto Aim turned on with XIM?  I always had it turned off... maybe I should try turning it on and also see about dialing in my sensitivities better?  I'm still not completely sold on playing direct, and all of my button mappings just got wiped out somehow, so I'm certainly willing to go back to XIM
- KJabs
-Xbox Series X (at MSRP from Best Buy!) using Xbox One Controller and XIM4
-Xbox One Day One Edition (Retired) and XIM4
-Xbox 360 with XIM3 (Retired)
-------------
-XIM4: $125
-XIM3: $150
-Improved COD K/D: PRICELESS.
-------------
Current New as of 2021-09:
Razer Tartarus V2
New Razer or Logitech Mouse TBD
Retired as of 2021-09:
Belkin Nostromo n52
Logitech G9x

Offline TurboMan

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Do you play with Auto Aim turned on with XIM?  I always had it turned off... maybe I should try turning it on and also see about dialing in my sensitivities better?  I'm still not completely sold on playing direct, and all of my button mappings just got wiped out somehow, so I'm certainly willing to go back to XIM

Playing with aim assist off on a XIM is a terrible idea IMO. So not only are you not getting the assists that your opponents are getting (which often at close range react to enemy movement quicker than you ever could) but you've also got mouse movement that isn't quite completely linear. Dial in your settings so they work well with the aim assist and you should have an advantage.