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Why I believe that using a XIM is NOT cheating  (Read 2417 times)

Offline Enrix

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Why I believe that using a XIM is NOT cheating
« on: 05:27 AM - 11/28/18 »
Greetings,
I usually have no problems telling people I play with that I am using a XIM, but almost every time I've been told that I'm cheating. I've been asked some stupid questions, because they believe stupid things.
So I am making this post to prove that it's definitely not true and to clarify some things.
The main problem is ignorance.

First of all, I've been asked "Oh you play on M/KB? So you can do this or that like on PC!"
No. The game still thinks that I am using a controller, so I can't do anything that controllers can't already do. It's not like I have more features or anything. There is nothing I can do that controllers can't.

Now let's talk about Aim Assist. I've been told that I have aim assist with a mouse, and that's definitely OP.
Well let me ask you one question, why do you think PC players don't have aim assist?
Because Aim Assist and a Mouse don't go well together! AA it's just a hindrance because of the accuracy of the mouse.
Sometimes it slows your aim too much and won't let you reach or stay on target. AA is something made for controllers.
We XIM users have to fine tune our settings to deal with it :)

Well then just disable Aim Assist when possible and you will have perfect aim like on PC, right? (Yes, I've been told this as well). Guess what? Just because we are on console, games often have some weird look mechanics with acceleration or stuff like that, to make the use of a controller more comfortable. Of course I don't mean that playing with AA off it's not possible, it just does not give you a PC feeling. Also depends on the game.

Of course using a XIM has its advantages, otherwise why would I use it, but at the end of the day, it does not give you an unfair advantage and it's definitely not cheating. Players who say otherwise are just ignorant or are making excuses.

Hope you enjoyed this read, share your experiences! Have you ever had a conversation like this with someone?
Cheers~


« Last Edit: 05:36 AM - 11/28/18 by Enrix »
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XIM APEX and mouse settings guide:
https://community.xim.tech/index.php?topic=66901.0

Is the XIM cheating?
https://community.xim.tech/index.php?topic=72737.0

Offline Jamesbone

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Re: Why I believe that using a XIM is NOT cheating
« Reply #1 on: 07:20 AM - 11/28/18 »
From all the years I have gamed, i learned to keep your circle small.

I pretty much just MUTE everyone, gaming is extremely toxic these days
I used to think PC was toxic,  console is on another level

Offline JDM

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Re: Why I believe that using a XIM is NOT cheating
« Reply #2 on: 08:16 AM - 11/28/18 »
Since I was a Controller player people would ask / accuse if I used Mouse and Keyboard so I guess Iíve always been a ď cheater ď ( good at games.... )

Back then I didnít even know it was possible to do so, for that reason I never really understood. The console mouse community has definitely grown since then and I think itís a good thing.

 Personally I donít think itís made me a better player as Iíve always been someone who notices what went wrong on my end if I died and adapted to working on bad habits that would cause deaths, my playstyle hasnít changed one bit, the KD ratios Iím getting havenít changed one bit, the reactions from friends on how I play havenít changed one bit so I really think it depends on the player.

When I first purchased my Xim 4 (which wasnít very long ago, I brought it just before last Christmas and then returned it and waited for the Apex * I WENT BACK TO CONTROLLER WITH 0 ISSUES * ) I was very upset at the fact it didnít seem to make me any better, I was having a harder time getting kills, a harder time pressing buttons, just a hard time in general. Once I got used to it I really didnít see an improvement, I just donít get finger pains from playing claw on a controller I had to force myself through pain to get used to.

I know this wasnít really about cheating but thatís a really easy argument to end.


Sony licence their own Mouse adapter for PlayStation....


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Offline 1ME

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Re: Why I believe that using a XIM is NOT cheating
« Reply #3 on: 09:02 AM - 11/28/18 »
At the end of the day, the game devs define what cheating is, and not salty console plebs. When I get accused of cheating .. I couldn't care less !  ;D

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Play fair, have fun

Offline JDM

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Re: Why I believe that using a XIM is NOT cheating
« Reply #4 on: 10:18 AM - 11/28/18 »
At the end of the day, the game devs define what cheating is, and not salty console plebs. When I get accused of cheating .. I couldn't care less !  ;D

Iím mean I could agree but Iíd say itís the console company, the game devs can just chose for the game not to be licences by Sony or Microsoft if itís such an issue lol
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Offline alanmcgregor

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Re: Why I believe that using a XIM is NOT cheating
« Reply #5 on: 01:29 PM - 11/28/18 »
Nice post OP, I agree with you is ignorance with a grain of salt, though.

I'm OK with a the controller, in some games I prefer it over XIM, like: RDR2, BO4. which allows me to see clearly the strengths and weaknesses of each device.

Like you said, people think that M&KB with XIM is identical to true native mouse input; can't blame them they don't have one. When they ask me how performs, I explain that is translating the movement and is limited due turn limit on consoles, I do the analogy of comparing to an old 90's mouse with a ball instead of a optical sensor, to give them some contrast, or a steering wheel with hydraulic system vs raw, anyways while joking they say is cheating.

I told them cheating is a big stretch, it give me an edge YES, but is not cheating. None of them plays with bare regular controller, they some have scuffs or kontrolfreaks... so I point that out, why you play by using those?, they say:
"Well, is more comfortable, I have big hands, feel more precision..."
- Yes that's exactly my point, those items gives you an edge over a regular controller,
same XIM does for me.

I'm not wall-hacking, not instant killing, that is cheating and no need skill.

And there is another layer, XIM users accusing me and others, of cheating because due the use of a scripting/macro device.

In all honesty, when it comes to macros and scripting the ones that I do is to simplify clunky mechanics and quality of life. I mean, not bragging but all the ideas I came up for Fortnite were adopted by Epic, I just give you a 9 months head start, so now that are official in the game, are not cheating?, hehehe no it never was cheating, was having the edge.

Scripting devices make things automatically, and that's all. Granted a hard skilled maneuver, can be made automatically by pressing a button, this type of shortcut (be able to do the move, without earning or learn it by hand) it can be cheap, or some things like jitter that are definitely giving you an unfear advantage.

Every single athlete that competes will do what ever they can to win a medal. If you think they are not using drugs or performance enhancers to outperform what they blessing genetics can to have the edge. If you don't know it or don't what to admit it well, is your choice. Same like all your favorite competitive players or streamers, they are not using cheap hardware a gaming pc from walmart, right?, they use the best, and macros and scripts etc.

But this is video-games, I see as a valve to relieve stress; I'm not tryharding 100% only at my job to support my family. I want to play with my friends on their consoles, joking around thorough the voice chat and have a good time.

XIM allows me to enjoy my gaming the way I want and with the people I care.
« Last Edit: 01:47 PM - 11/28/18 by alanmcgregor »

Offline Enrix

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Re: Why I believe that using a XIM is NOT cheating
« Reply #6 on: 04:11 PM - 11/28/18 »
And there is another layer, XIM users accusing me and others, of cheating because due the use of a scripting/macro device.
Nice reply man, about the macro: the XIM itself does not support macros. You need to use third party software, the same way controllers can use the Titan usb thingy. Also some controllers like the Nacon support macros, so :)
I also agree with the point that we play games for fun, with friends. It's not our job.
PS4 Pro with SSD | Razer Ornata Chroma | Logitech G403 | Steelseries Siberia 800 | BenQ XL2420T

XIM APEX and mouse settings guide:
https://community.xim.tech/index.php?topic=66901.0

Is the XIM cheating?
https://community.xim.tech/index.php?topic=72737.0

Offline Sl3vin

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Re: Why I believe that using a XIM is NOT cheating
« Reply #7 on: 11:07 PM - 11/28/18 »
Its not cheating, right. But its not fair and we all know that :-)
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Offline ceebs

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Re: Why I believe that using a XIM is NOT cheating
« Reply #8 on: 03:35 AM - 11/29/18 »
Its not cheating, right. But its not fair and we all know that :-)
Rubbish. It is fair. People that think XIM is cheating are uneducated. Peeps that think it's unfair are being hypocritical.

I used to play football when I was a kid. My parents couldn't afford to buy me football boots so I had to play in a cheap pair of trainers. I was slipping and sliding around on wet days whilst the kids with the Copa Mundials were running circles around me. I didn't think that that was unfair (I thought life was unfair!) I just knew that I lacked the proper equipment needed to play better.

If you think that the XIM is unfair, then you must also think that gaming steering wheels and pedals; scuff controllers; fight sticks; headsets; fast, hi res monitors; more powerful versions of a console and even Kontrol Freaks are unfair, as they all give the user an edge. They're available to everyone that can afford them. Do you think they are unfair?

I think it's unfair that the games that were created for PC, 15/20 years ago, are now designed on PCs for consoles and PC gets the sh!tty leftovers.
I think it's unfair that I have to buy a console just to play online with my mates.
I think it's unfair that game devs don't support native keyboard and mouse, the devices that I have gamed with for over 20 years.
The world is not fair. The fact that it doesn't work the way I want it to is unfair. Can't apply that thinking to XIM though. It moves my gaming needs closer to being fair.

Where's HL3?

XIM Apex, PS4 Pro, Crucial MX500 1TB, T9+, Swiftpoint Z, Aorus AMP500, Audio Technica AD700, Modmic 5, SB X7, LG 27UD58.

MSI Z97i Gaming AC, Intel Core i5 [email protected], Corsair H100i, EVGA GTX780, 16gb G-Skill [email protected], XFX ProSeries 750w, 3xAerocool Dead Silence, Cooltek W1, 3xSamsung Evo 500 SSD, WD 1TB HDD, Silverstone SST slot-load DVD, KustomPC braided cables. And if you've read this far, you too are a genuine geek, my friend!

Offline Enrix

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Re: Why I believe that using a XIM is NOT cheating
« Reply #9 on: 07:51 AM - 11/29/18 »
Its not cheating, right. But its not fair and we all know that :-)
Why do you think it's unfair after everything I said?
PS4 Pro with SSD | Razer Ornata Chroma | Logitech G403 | Steelseries Siberia 800 | BenQ XL2420T

XIM APEX and mouse settings guide:
https://community.xim.tech/index.php?topic=66901.0

Is the XIM cheating?
https://community.xim.tech/index.php?topic=72737.0

Offline MistuhLee

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Re: Why I believe that using a XIM is NOT cheating
« Reply #10 on: 11:44 AM - 11/29/18 »
Nice post OP, I agree with you is ignorance with a grain of salt, though.

I'm OK with a the controller, in some games I prefer it over XIM, like: RDR2, BO4. which allows me to see clearly the strengths and weaknesses of each device.

Like you said, people think that M&KB with XIM is identical to true native mouse input; can't blame them they don't have one. When they ask me how performs, I explain that is translating the movement and is limited due turn limit on consoles, I do the analogy of comparing to an old 90's mouse with a ball instead of a optical sensor, to give them some contrast, or a steering wheel with hydraulic system vs raw, anyways while joking they say is cheating.

I told them cheating is a big stretch, it give me an edge YES, but is not cheating. None of them plays with bare regular controller, they some have scuffs or kontrolfreaks... so I point that out, why you play by using those?, they say:
"Well, is more comfortable, I have big hands, feel more precision..."
- Yes that's exactly my point, those items gives you an edge over a regular controller,
same XIM does for me.

I'm not wall-hacking, not instant killing, that is cheating and no need skill.

And there is another layer, XIM users accusing me and others, of cheating because due the use of a scripting/macro device.

In all honesty, when it comes to macros and scripting the ones that I do is to simplify clunky mechanics and quality of life. I mean, not bragging but all the ideas I came up for Fortnite were adopted by Epic, I just give you a 9 months head start, so now that are official in the game, are not cheating?, hehehe no it never was cheating, was having the edge.

Scripting devices make things automatically, and that's all. Granted a hard skilled maneuver, can be made automatically by pressing a button, this type of shortcut (be able to do the move, without earning or learn it by hand) it can be cheap, or some things like jitter that are definitely giving you an unfear advantage.

Every single athlete that competes will do what ever they can to win a medal. If you think they are not using drugs or performance enhancers to outperform what they blessing genetics can to have the edge. If you don't know it or don't what to admit it well, is your choice. Same like all your favorite competitive players or streamers, they are not using cheap hardware a gaming pc from walmart, right?, they use the best, and macros and scripts etc.

But this is video-games, I see as a valve to relieve stress; I'm not tryharding 100% only at my job to support my family. I want to play with my friends on their consoles, joking around thorough the voice chat and have a good time.

XIM allows me to enjoy my gaming the way I want and with the people I care.


Exactly my point as well to a friend. He believes it's cheating as he uses a scuf. I explained is the back paddles not the same as modification? YOu have an edge over those end users who can not afford a 150$+ controller.  The world is just too @#$% sensitive now -a -days and always want stuff to be "Even" when "Fair" and "Even" are perceptive based and only defined by users who typically feel they are being left in the dust.

Offline nunosm

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Re: Why I believe that using a XIM is NOT cheating
« Reply #11 on: 03:38 AM - 11/30/18 »
I use Xim on a Ps4 Pro, simply because i always played FPS using a mouse and keyboard (wolfenstein back in the days) and cannot coordinate eye / hand the same with a controller - Call me an old hog!

I play with my kid that, using a DS4 simply melts everyone in the game (Destiny, BF1, Fortnite), why? Because he always used a controller.

Is it cheating to use a XIM? I dont think so. It all depends on situation awareness, flanking / approach, weapon choose for each scenario, good 1ms screen, etc. Those are the things that diferenciate a pro from a noob. The human interface that each one of us use to interact with the game dont make us a better gamer - its just a personal choice.

Now if the discution is "macro land", my oppinion differs, because i feel that using no recoil / fast shooting macro's etc is gaining an real in-game advantage, and for the sake of good online gaming sportmanship, should not be used. But hey, each of us have a conscience and i love to be 1st in the game, without "macro" crouches!

Offline Enrix

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Re: Why I believe that using a XIM is NOT cheating
« Reply #12 on: 06:06 AM - 11/30/18 »
Now if the discution is "macro land", my oppinion differs, because i feel that using no recoil / fast shooting macro's etc is gaining an real in-game advantage, and for the sake of good online gaming sportmanship, should not be used. But hey, each of us have a conscience and i love to be 1st in the game, without "macro" crouches!
I agree!
PS4 Pro with SSD | Razer Ornata Chroma | Logitech G403 | Steelseries Siberia 800 | BenQ XL2420T

XIM APEX and mouse settings guide:
https://community.xim.tech/index.php?topic=66901.0

Is the XIM cheating?
https://community.xim.tech/index.php?topic=72737.0

Offline legit

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Re: Why I believe that using a XIM is NOT cheating
« Reply #13 on: 11:12 AM - 11/30/18 »
Now let's talk about Aim Assist. I've been told that I have aim assist with a mouse, and that's definitely OP.
Nailed it.

Well let me ask you one question, why do you think PC players don't have aim assist?
Because you don't need aim assist for MK! You already have the tools to be extremly accurate and precise..

Because Aim Assist and a Mouse don't go well together! AA it's just a hindrance because of the accuracy of the mouse.
What?

You're not only playing with the clearly superior input device, which absolutely smashes controllers into the ground, you also get a "hidden aimbot" mechanic that was intended to help people aim with a primitive input device (aka controller).
The effect you achieve when aiming with a xim is stronger than any silent aim cheat on pc.

Sometimes it slows your aim too much and won't let you reach or stay on target.
No, once you're on the target, the AA never let's you move off your opponent again.
Yes, sometimes you need to apply additional force to push through the "bubble". You can either get used to it or ..

.. just have a look at one of the many detailed (video) guides that show you how to get rid of that "problem". Here are a few:
https://community.xim.tech/index.php?topic=49063.0
https://community.xim.tech/index.php?topic=71619.0
https://youtu.be/o7yvB4a0YVU

Also, I don't recall controllers having features like "Boost" and "Steady Aim", that allow me to exploit aim assist..

It's definitely you who is ignorant.

Offline alanmcgregor

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Re: Why I believe that using a XIM is NOT cheating
« Reply #14 on: 12:55 PM - 11/30/18 »
Also, I don't recall controllers having features like "Boost" and "Steady Aim", that allow me to exploit aim assist..

It's definitely you who is ignorant.
Boost and Steady Aim, are meant to get rid of aim assist not to exploit it, there is not a single feature on XIM Manager meant to exploit Aim Assist, and the Smart Translators are build with games aim-assist OFF.

So, there it is... you can't blame this people, they don't own one and are salty, enough to create an account.