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1:1 ADS Sensitivity insights?  (Read 1223 times)

Offline robbo0

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1:1 ADS Sensitivity insights?
« on: 05:52 PM - 04/03/19 »
Not sure I was clear enough in my original post

PC FPS games naturally give you the same HIP & ADS sens, e.g. there's no transition in speed/distance on pad to be moved.

On console the ADS is naturally slower than the HIP, which is understandable for controller players.

I notice most people who post settings here have a lower ADS sens than HIP, which surprises me as I thought most would want to replicate PC M&K feeling.

Is there an easy way to make my HIP and ADS the same sens with the XIM? As in 1:1 feeling between the two aim styles?

At the moment I try to manually do this by slowly doing a 180 hip turn and then doing the same with ADS until my mouse starts and ends in the same place on my pad; usually giving a higher ADS value. This doesn't seem consistent though, which I imagine is to do with max turn speed both by XIM and by what ever hard coding the game used for ads speed.

I'm surprised I'm the only one I see with a higher ADS XIM sens than HIP to try and replicate the PC FPS style

-----------------------------

Hey,

Just wanted to get some clarity on ADS sensitivity ratios if anybody knows about the following.

If you match the hip sensitivity (eg. 10) with hip translators to the same as your ADS sensitivity (eg. 10) with ADS translators... Is this supposedly a 1:1 mouse sensitivity in terms of what the Xim apex produces?

I ask as I wish to know a good baseline to work from when trying to get a 1:1 between the two aim styles.

I understand some games will have a fixed ADS ratio etc that would then make my above example not 1:1 and so would require you to change it in the Xim manager.

Could someone also explains the key differences between the hip translators and ADS translators and what happens if you used one type of translator for both hip & ADS?

Any insight is appreciated
« Last Edit: 05:39 AM - 11/09/19 by robbo0 »

Offline antithesis

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Re: 1:1 ADS Sensitivity insights?
« Reply #1 on: 06:09 PM - 04/03/19 »
No-one can tell you a formula for the perfect ADS speed, it's highly subjective. But based on look speed to track a moving enemy, ADS should typically be set to 65 - 75% of HIP speed.

The same is true even if using the HIP Translator for ADS. I use HIP for ADS in BO4 with the same sensitivity for both HIP & ADS. However, in-game ADS speed is set to 75%, which is within the expected HIP > ADS range.


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Offline dan_94

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Re: 1:1 ADS Sensitivity insights?
« Reply #2 on: 12:42 AM - 04/04/19 »
First of all, like antithesis said, most games have a lower ADS speed even if you use the same speed in you XIM settings. Further i understand why people claim to use the same speed for ADS and HIP (build up muscle memory), but you can obviously also build up muscle memory with your ADS alone and its much easier to aim well with a SENS below the turn speed of your HIP (HIP is mostly only for close combat and turning fast, so there is no need to be perfect precise when firing from HIP)

To answer your question :
Most games have different ADS and HIPS sens cause as controller gamer you need a way lower ADS than HIP. Sometimes thats the only difference, so ST will be trained for ADS as well, but there is really no difference in the look mechanic (you can use HIP on both). On the other hand, there are games with different deadzones or even different look mechanics on HIP and ADS. Therefore its necessary that you use the ADS ST.
In general i would not change the ADS ST to the HIP ST, even though the can always try and maybe it feels better for you.

To adjust a 1 to 1 for both, you can measure your cm on mousepad and ingame turn radius (turn slowly so you dont hit the turn cap)

Offline GamingNerd

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Re: 1:1 ADS Sensitivity insights?
« Reply #3 on: 03:11 AM - 04/04/19 »
Hey,

Just wanted to get some clarity on ADS sensitivity ratios if anybody knows about the following.

If you match the hip sensitivity (eg. 10) with hip translators to the same as your ADS sensitivity (eg. 10) with ADS translators... Is this supposedly a 1:1 mouse sensitivity in terms of what the Xim apex produces?

I ask as I wish to know a good baseline to work from when trying to get a 1:1 between the two aim styles.

I understand some games will have a fixed ADS ratio etc that would then make my above example not 1:1 and so would require you to change it in the Xim manager.

Could someone also explains the key differences between the hip translators and ADS translators and what happens if you used one type of translator for both hip & ADS?

Any insight is appreciated
As long as you don't mess with the ballistics curve both will be 1:1 no matter what sensitivity you use. To answer your initial question matching both sensitivities will make them 1:1 senstivitiy wise because 10/10=1. But, the ads translator feels slightly slowed compared to hip on some games. If you want, you can unbind the ads and only use hip for both. Or you can go into the ads translator and scroll to the bottom and change it from ads to hip translator if you want to lower your hip sensitivity when aiming down sight for more accuracy. You won't mess anything up by doing this if that's what you're thinking. The possibilities are endless. You can play around with it.

By the way, I forgot to mention that I personally always match my hip and ads. They are never different. I did the same with a controller so it just feels right when they match.
The Xim is not a magical tool that is going to make you a god. Time, effort and perseverance is what will take your gaming to the next level.

[Ps4] [Sony Nav] [T9 Gamepad] [Logitech G502 Proteus] [Dpi's: 12,000, 3200, 4000, 2400] [Syncs: Off and Common]

Offline SweatyPapi

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Re: 1:1 ADS Sensitivity insights?
« Reply #4 on: 12:32 PM - 04/08/19 »
Interesting topic as I was inquiring about this and I tested it a lot within the BO4 configurations. I can make a post about my findings if that is the game  mechanics you are referring too. After 20,000 points  in league matches against increased skill of players using things like strafing to mess up AA bubble and more than 10,000s of bots shot, I believe I figured it out although I am hardheaded so I play on high sensitivity anyway knowing that. You will be surprised of some of the findings plus "camera" movement findings :)  had me laugh to the end of how Controller friendly the mechanic is.

Now if you are talking in game ADS %, I think of this as the percentage amount but another way to think about this is HEAVY steady aim but Super AA, and I mean it's almost Aimbot. literally it moves your center to hit target.

75% and 50% to abuse AA
1.25x and above to decrease it (PC like feeling as it also breaks through AA like butter, Highly lowers AA)

"But SweatyPapi, what about the AA Bubble!? I can't run that low a sens without getting in and out of it and I will miss some shots!"
Me: "Not with Boost and Steady Aim you won't" ;) Adjust until you are

oh thats not enough?
you want Aim bot?
oh you want to 360 high skilled players?

MJFRAME Common sync 800-3200 DPI with .50-.75 ADS sensitivity.
Move > button of Ballistic Curve (ADS) from between 4-10 values, then scroll right side value up until it reaches 100. Explain in MJforum if you don't know what I am talking about. Increase in Value= Increase in work room of micro movement before jump of sensitivity.

HIP Translator at default or MJFRAME- Your preference! I use Default and ADS Translator on hip for Better Muscle Memory

 Higher the Value of ballistic: More AA, More work room to aim, less sensitivity. Pick your trade off.

Why should I use this rather than Default Ballistic? They actually aren't that different. It just allows you to play at a high sensitivity while any time you can slow it all the way down for max AA. It's Snap Aim friendly while also ADS target to target friendly. it's still technically 1:1 but takes kinda advantage of AA, also it takes advantage of high sens.

I Personally don't go higher than 1600 DPI while using. You need to be "cracked", if not it will feel sluggish. My ballistic curve is moved to 6.
Default- Sync
0.75 ADS

Difference between normal sensitivity and ADS sensitivity at lower value? that little addition of AA is at least 1-2 hit markers extra. Ask yourself if a weapon is killing in 4-5, then 1-2 makes a huge difference. especially in competitive. with the same sensitivity and the curve helps as well.
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Offline SweatyPapi

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Re: 1:1 ADS Sensitivity insights?
« Reply #5 on: 01:09 PM - 04/08/19 »
I forgot to mention the cons:
1. Unresponsive feeling
2. If sensitivity is not right it isn't good. If I find a sens where I track right, I just increase or decrease boost to make up the rest
3. If you change your sensitivity TOO much without  practicing for at least 10 minutes, you will be disappointing.
4. Decrease in muscle memory (if you don't practice for 2-3 days, don't expect a beemer unless you shot 500-1000 bots minimum. Put in the WORK FAM
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Offline antithesis

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Re: 1:1 ADS Sensitivity insights?
« Reply #6 on: 04:37 PM - 04/08/19 »
mjfame's settings make exactly zero difference to micromovements, nor any effect on target snapping.

His curves are ONLY sensitivity multipliers along the entire length - there is no improvement to micro-aim, which would require deceleration, not linear.

The only reason to try his settings are -

1. You want to use 800 DPI @ 1000Hz with Sync > Off. The objective of the curve here is simply to exceed the hard cap of 500 Sens on XIM. Do not use with Sync of Default, Common or Slow - there's no reason for it as you won't hit the hard cap.
2. You want to use 12K DPI @ 1000Hz with Sync > Off. The objective of the curve here is to use the lowest possible XIM sensitivity to attempt to use raw sensor input.

Both use cases are completely pointless because 800 DPI @ Sync Off provides the same experience as 12K DPI @ Sync Off in BO4. The curve is a sensitivity slider, nothing more. Secondly, XIM Apex already calculates sensitivity scaling under the hood, so this is simply a redundant manual setting that stacks with internal calculations and eats up the Ballistics Curve slot.

The worst part of these curves is that very high DPI can cause jitter and very low DPI can cause pixel-skipping. mj used Smoothing at 20 to counter that, but high Smoothing adds delay to movement and makes aim feel floaty...terrible idea!

Being 100% serious - mjfame's settings are a placebo. Using a higher DPI than 800 with Sync Off and Sensitivity within the XIM's normal range is EXACTLY the same. I understand what he was trying to do, but it has no positive effect on either mouse input or game mechanics.

The curve has value if you have an older mouse or alternative input device such as a trackball that can't pull more than 800 DPI on a XIM4 where Response Rate is fixed at 125Hz and Sync is fixed at 120Hz. In that use case, XIM4 sens at 500 will still feel slow and sensitivity can only be further increased via a linear Ballistic Curve.
« Last Edit: 04:59 PM - 04/08/19 by antithesis »

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Offline SweatyPapi

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Re: 1:1 ADS Sensitivity insights?
« Reply #7 on: 05:20 PM - 04/08/19 »
Yo man I think I know where he messed up. Itís the sync that makes no sens. Try it on common. And it does kinda. ďA placeabo snapping effect". It doesn't make a difference when it comes to your aim. However, where he went wrong was that the curve is great for aim assist if sync was right.

I believed it was a pleasebo at first, but then what I did to test this was trying to emulate this guys aim using either MJ curve or default. I measured cm to make sure it was same sensitivities.

Let's just say if you have the right settings, MJ frame curve is aim bot in high AA games, low aim assist and this wouldn't work well.

What he did wrong was try to make a better 1:1 ratio and decrease of AA instead of trying to either focus on efficient Strong AA or cutting through it (like RML curve). The Japanese guy rubbed off on me and I took the exact opposite approach and it works  great

Watch as he snaps from target to target, the default curve canít do this as good:

https://youtu.be/J3Xm4HF8K28

To summarize, itís like having two ads sensitivities. One to snap and one that just shoots straight if your mouse is still.
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Offline antithesis

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Re: 1:1 ADS Sensitivity insights?
« Reply #8 on: 05:24 PM - 04/08/19 »
I've watched the video and tested the settings. I expected a magnetic snapping, but it makes zero difference over a regular curve & adjusting sensitivity because the curve is linear. The guy just has good aim (also the video is sped up).

OBsIV stated that a steep linear curve is nothing more than a sensitivity multiplier and he's right. There is no micromovement advantage to be had because sensitivity along the entire length of the curve is multiplied. Small micromovements are amplified.

If you want stronger AA, use analog input...simples.

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Offline robbo0

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Re: 1:1 ADS Sensitivity insights?
« Reply #9 on: 05:35 AM - 11/09/19 »
Not sure I was clear enough in my original post

PC FPS games naturally give you the same HIP & ADS sens, e.g. there's no transition in speed/distance on pad to be moved.

On console the ADS is naturally slower than the HIP, which is understandable for controller players.

I notice most people who post settings here have a lower ADS sens than HIP, which surprises me as I thought most would want to replicate PC M&K feeling.

Is there an easy way to make my HIP and ADS the same sens with the XIM? As in 1:1 feeling between the two aim styles?

At the moment I try to manually do this by slowly doing a 180 hip turn and then doing the same with ADS until my mouse starts and ends in the same place on my pad; usually giving a higher ADS value. This doesn't seem consistent though, which I imagine is to do with max turn speed both by XIM and by what ever hard coding the game used for ads speed.

I'm surprised I'm the only one I see with a higher ADS XIM sens than HIP to try and replicate the PC FPS style

Offline Bb4life1991

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Re: 1:1 ADS Sensitivity insights?
« Reply #10 on: 05:54 AM - 11/09/19 »
One thing that i will say is guys please stop saying there is floaty aim or delay when using 20 smoothing. This is the case but not with 1000hz no floaty feeling what so ever. Yes with 125hz ,250hz,500hz yes will be floaty delay....mjfame went over this the 1000hz cancels it can yall go try it an tell me where u feel this floaty feeling? Next point yes guys the curve is simply a sense multiplier nothing else if anything i think the snap affect if people mean when its snapping on to targets with aim assist i think its the 20 smoothing thats whats doing it for sure i think thats a huge thing that makes his config work so well not the fake curve. Whether the xim is different or not in my opinion high dpi will not give best accuracy due to logitech engineer explaining what happens when you go high dpi hand down you lose performance,an precision an accuracy.

Offline Bb4life1991

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Re: 1:1 ADS Sensitivity insights?
« Reply #11 on: 05:55 AM - 11/09/19 »
Like stated above to get a 1:1 feel id assume u need to yes have hip translator on both pages or ads translator on both pages and idk if thatll even work for sure. Only other way id assume is what u said before measuring ur 180 or 360 spin an even then it wont be perfect

Offline Bb4life1991

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Re: 1:1 ADS Sensitivity insights?
« Reply #12 on: 05:59 AM - 11/09/19 »
I also think the smoothing is huge in mjfames config anytime i introduce it the aim assist works with you way more then without it im assuming its due to replicating controller like behavior. If you wanna test this theory use 1000hz common see how strong aim assist is then use 1000hz common an 20 smoothing an watch how much better it is

Another thing i find very intersting....when i use 125hz an common sync i have the least amount of aim assist possible. An have more aim assist with 125hz an off sync. This also transsers over when using 1000hz and use off sync an 20 smoothing then 1000hx common sync an 20 smoothing the common has less aim assist so that definitely confuses me an makes me think off has more aim assist then common. People also say 125hz should be most aim assist yet to me its the least which makes me think cause its controller like idk its very odd things I experience but i now only use 800 dpi an common sync an 20 smoothing an have alot easier time cutting through aim assist

One thing i donít understand is this though still baffles me. When i use 800 dpi then 16000 i use the calculator. How is it my 360 spin is the same for both but my sense on 16000 feels way to fast yet its 360 spin is same ? But i actually have to lower the sense with 16000 which then in turn makes my 360 not as far? An then strengthens my aim assist? Which makes me think all in all dpi wont have a huge affect on aim assist if with lower dpi you just raise ur sense to feel how it feels when ur on 16000dpi. To me high dpi just feels slightly off innacurate compared to 800 idk why

If someone gets bored an wants to take a listen about dpi xim or native xim cant magically make these things false i wouldnt think

https://youtu.be/lc7JVjcPzL0
« Last Edit: 06:42 AM - 11/09/19 by Bb4life1991 »

Online slickrick

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Re: 1:1 ADS Sensitivity insights?
« Reply #13 on: 09:37 AM - 11/09/19 »
I also think the smoothing is huge in mjfames config anytime i introduce it the aim assist works with you way more then without it im assuming its due to replicating controller like behavior. If you wanna test this theory use 1000hz common see how strong aim assist is then use 1000hz common an 20 smoothing an watch how much better it is

Another thing i find very intersting....when i use 125hz an common sync i have the least amount of aim assist possible. An have more aim assist with 125hz an off sync. This also transsers over when using 1000hz and use off sync an 20 smoothing then 1000hx common sync an 20 smoothing the common has less aim assist so that definitely confuses me an makes me think off has more aim assist then common. People also say 125hz should be most aim assist yet to me its the least which makes me think cause its controller like idk its very odd things I experience but i now only use 800 dpi an common sync an 20 smoothing an have alot easier time cutting through aim assist

One thing i donít understand is this though still baffles me. When i use 800 dpi then 16000 i use the calculator. How is it my 360 spin is the same for both but my sense on 16000 feels way to fast yet its 360 spin is same ? But i actually have to lower the sense with 16000 which then in turn makes my 360 not as far? An then strengthens my aim assist? Which makes me think all in all dpi wont have a huge affect on aim assist if with lower dpi you just raise ur sense to feel how it feels when ur on 16000dpi. To me high dpi just feels slightly off innacurate compared to 800 idk why

If someone gets bored an wants to take a listen about dpi xim or native xim cant magically make these things false i wouldnt think

https://youtu.be/lc7JVjcPzL0
I'm going to give you my opinion on whats baffling you about 16000 dpi seeming faster than 800 with  same sen.   dots per inch [dpi] is the hardware sensitivity of you mouse. the higher you set it,  the more  intense the mouse reacts to small movements. thats the reason most people that try to use aa has a lower dpi, if your hand is not  real steady you wont break out of the aa when your locked in and on target, meaning if Im locked in and move the mouse a 16th of an inch with 800 dpi , Im probably not going to break out like I would with a higher sensitivity[DPI], there are ways around having high dpi and it being super sensitive, its called smoothing. smoothing is the interpolation of raw input data to prevent jerky mouse movement. 

Offline Bb4life1991

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Re: 1:1 ADS Sensitivity insights?
« Reply #14 on: 09:57 AM - 11/09/19 »
I also think the smoothing is huge in mjfames config anytime i introduce it the aim assist works with you way more then without it im assuming its due to replicating controller like behavior. If you wanna test this theory use 1000hz common see how strong aim assist is then use 1000hz common an 20 smoothing an watch how much better it is

Another thing i find very intersting....when i use 125hz an common sync i have the least amount of aim assist possible. An have more aim assist with 125hz an off sync. This also transsers over when using 1000hz and use off sync an 20 smoothing then 1000hx common sync an 20 smoothing the common has less aim assist so that definitely confuses me an makes me think off has more aim assist then common. People also say 125hz should be most aim assist yet to me its the least which makes me think cause its controller like idk its very odd things I experience but i now only use 800 dpi an common sync an 20 smoothing an have alot easier time cutting through aim assist

One thing i donít understand is this though still baffles me. When i use 800 dpi then 16000 i use the calculator. How is it my 360 spin is the same for both but my sense on 16000 feels way to fast yet its 360 spin is same ? But i actually have to lower the sense with 16000 which then in turn makes my 360 not as far? An then strengthens my aim assist? Which makes me think all in all dpi wont have a huge affect on aim assist if with lower dpi you just raise ur sense to feel how it feels when ur on 16000dpi. To me high dpi just feels slightly off innacurate compared to 800 idk why

If someone gets bored an wants to take a listen about dpi xim or native xim cant magically make these things false i wouldnt think

https://youtu.be/lc7JVjcPzL0
I'm going to give you my opinion on whats baffling you about 16000 dpi seeming faster than 800 with  same sen.   dots per inch [dpi] is the hardware sensitivity of you mouse. the higher you set it,  the more  intense the mouse reacts to small movements. thats the reason most people that try to use aa has a lower dpi, if your hand is not  real steady you wont break out of the aa when your locked in and on target, meaning if Im locked in and move the mouse a 16th of an inch with 800 dpi , Im probably not going to break out like I would with a higher sensitivity[DPI], there are ways around having high dpi and it being super sensitive, its called smoothing. smoothing is the interpolation of raw input data to prevent jerky mouse movement.

Yes that all makes sense its just odd in end my 360 spin ends up being the same with them both. U would think the 16000 would go further being in shorter movements it feels so quick though to where i then have to lower my sense which now means my 360 isnt as big and due to lowering my sense that increases aim assist in itself. Thus resulting  in me just sticking with 800dpi an upping sense to where it feels good. To make that way my aim assist is about the same whether i use low or high dpi. Cause when i match my 360 spin with high dpi with shorter movments or hip firing or anything it moves alot quicker then 800 dpi. An almost feels accelerated to me 800 just feels way more smooth an clean. Then try an use high dpi on 125hz feels off use 800 dpi smooth as butter. Then with that on top of logitech engineers explanation of high dpi to me just makes more sense to stick to low dpi.

But appreciate your time an response an what you said makes sense i figured the whole more dots per inch is why it felt faster just i woulda thought 360 spin woulda went further also. Being more sensitive basically. So ya idk low dpi feels the best to me