XIM Community

OBsIV ... couple of questions? (For Advanced Xim players)  (Read 227006 times)

Offline thepr0

  • MVP
  • *
  • Posts: 553
    • View Profile
    • https://www.youtube.com/user/HellOnJerzZ
  • Gamertag: xJerzZx
  • PSN ID: JerzZthepr0
Re: OBsIV ... couple of questions? (For Advanced Xim players)
« Reply #645 on: 07:19 PM - 06/26/16 »
^Balls you would be a way better player if you used the ground more 98% of your gunfights are mid air.  most of the times it can work to your advantage but other times it makes you an easier target.  if your mid air aim is 70% i would like to see what it is like on the ground..thats my thoughts you have good control for your fast movements i just think you can do better in my opinion

Offline knox66

  • Member
  • *
  • Posts: 146
    • View Profile
  • PSN ID: shogun6x
Re: OBsIV ... couple of questions? (For Advanced Xim players)
« Reply #646 on: 11:11 PM - 06/26/16 »
ran RML new stuff tonight in destiny and liked the ADS really well!!! 92% crit on my snipes!!!! I am tweaking it a little but so far this new drop is the best i have seen!!!!

I do have a issue with the fact that i always seem to make the xim flash at me that i am making turn speeds. Still working on the small hand movements..
« Last Edit: 11:20 PM - 06/26/16 by knox66 »

Offline Playsat4n

  • Member
  • *
  • Posts: 7
    • View Profile
Re: OBsIV ... couple of questions? (For Advanced Xim players)
« Reply #647 on: 11:19 PM - 06/26/16 »
Ive played quite a bit with the built now and i really like it

For Overwatch having the boost at 1 really feels nice since the aim assist is less of a struggle to fight against
Would be great though if you could further increase its effect a bit more though, say up to -10

The higher values do what they should, the aim assist really gets stronger but not to a level where you lose control over you mousemovements
So the ximmers that would like to have this aim assist mode will really be happy with it, its modeled just right in my oppinion

Imo the only thing that could be worked on is increasing the lower scale so the anti aim assist gets a bit stronger :)
Maybe like suggested earlier, for the retail release a scale from -100 to +100 would be more intiutiv going by the wording of steady aim
0 to -100 covers anti aim assist
0 to 100 covers aim assist

Od1n I used it all day in Overwatch yesterday and it simply did not feel right, be it in hip or ADS. I tried varying values for boost 1/50/80/85/90. While I was able to break away from the bubble, the lack of inherent precision in the game's look mechanic and jitter as a result of the new SA meant that there was simply no way to make the micro-adjustments required to break back in to the bubble to land shots.

I ended up turning SA off. Even as Bastion, who has none-to-negligible aim assist while in Sentry mode, I was missing shots I would easily be making without SA.

Did you make any major adjustments to your sensitivity and/or use a curve of some kind?

Offline Deicidium

  • Member
  • *
  • Posts: 23
    • View Profile
Re: OBsIV ... couple of questions? (For Advanced Xim players)
« Reply #648 on: 02:37 AM - 06/27/16 »
Hi, I'm fairly new here and I want to try the new test fw, do I need to update also the xim4 app on my phone?

Offline Mark8010

  • Member
  • *
  • Posts: 160
    • View Profile
Re: OBsIV ... couple of questions? (For Advanced Xim players)
« Reply #649 on: 03:12 AM - 06/27/16 »
The reason it feels like it's a spike in sensitivity is because there are actually fewer possible aiming vectors possible as intensity goes up. It's being more aggressive in holding your aim steady so it'll feel like it's higher sensitivity even though it's not. You are still at the same "effective" sensitivity.

Od1n this change will not be included with the hardware change until the hardware change has had time to "bake" longer after release.

Not sure I fully understand this. In the previous firmware, if you increased the SA value for a given sensitivity it would steady your aim i.e. add more stickiness to your mouse movements - but the effect was not really felt until you hit the 80's - 95 values and small increments would lead to small improvements in SA.

In this firmware increasing the SA value has a net effect of decreasing the stickiness and has the same feeling that would be achieved by merely increasing your sensitivity. This effect of course is the opposite of what the previous firmware did.

In order to use a higher SA value I have to decrease my sensitivity by material amounts -  surely I should be able to use the same sensitivity value and merely adjust SA to give me less jitter and more stickiness i.e. the effect should be minor enough that sensitivities are not needed to be changed and higher SA should equate to a steadier aim / more stickiness (or however you want to describe it) when at the moment it's the opposite effect.

Offline RML

  • MVP
  • *
  • Posts: 6608
  • Live Different
    • View Profile
Re: OBsIV ... couple of questions? (For Advanced Xim players)
« Reply #650 on: 07:05 AM - 06/27/16 »

I do have a issue with the fact that i always seem to make the xim flash at me that i am making turn speeds. Still working on the small hand movements..

Destiny is virtually impossible not to red light, as long as you feel like you're not wasting movement I wouldn't worry about it.



Hi, I'm fairly new here and I want to try the new test fw, do I need to update also the xim4 app on my phone?

This firmware works with the latest Manager, so as long as you're running the latest you will be fine.

Offline Od1n

  • Global Moderator
  • MVP
  • *
  • Posts: 30810
    • View Profile
Re: OBsIV ... couple of questions? (For Advanced Xim players)
« Reply #651 on: 07:40 AM - 06/27/16 »
Ive played quite a bit with the built now and i really like it

For Overwatch having the boost at 1 really feels nice since the aim assist is less of a struggle to fight against
Would be great though if you could further increase its effect a bit more though, say up to -10

The higher values do what they should, the aim assist really gets stronger but not to a level where you lose control over you mousemovements
So the ximmers that would like to have this aim assist mode will really be happy with it, its modeled just right in my oppinion

Imo the only thing that could be worked on is increasing the lower scale so the anti aim assist gets a bit stronger :)
Maybe like suggested earlier, for the retail release a scale from -100 to +100 would be more intiutiv going by the wording of steady aim
0 to -100 covers anti aim assist
0 to 100 covers aim assist

Od1n I used it all day in Overwatch yesterday and it simply did not feel right, be it in hip or ADS. I tried varying values for boost 1/50/80/85/90. While I was able to break away from the bubble, the lack of inherent precision in the game's look mechanic and jitter as a result of the new SA meant that there was simply no way to make the micro-adjustments required to break back in to the bubble to land shots.

I ended up turning SA off. Even as Bastion, who has none-to-negligible aim assist while in Sentry mode, I was missing shots I would easily be making without SA.

Did you make any major adjustments to your sensitivity and/or use a curve of some kind?

i dont use any curves or stuff like that
my xim sensitivity is 25 hip and 15 ads with 3600 dpi

with boost values of higher than 90 yeah you start to notice the sensitivity increasement (further explained by obsiv above) but for overwatch more aim assist is really the wrong way to go
its better to reduce the aim assist with boost values of 1-5
with these values the micro-movement is pretty much just as good as without steady aim and on the plus side the aim assist is a bit less

what i mean with less:
when moving eg with the sniper zoom over a target the slowdown starts a lot later, usually when being already on the player model
without steady aim the slowdown starts around 10+ pixels next to the player model which makes it so hard to get your target on it
the steady aim helps here, since the slowdown happens a bit later you dont overshoot or undershoot so often


anyhow overwatch is not a good game for the steady aim feature because of its pretty unique aim assist
only csgo has a similar aim assist that mostly only consists out of slowdown, all other games use more intense/complex aim assists
the developers said an aim assist strength slider will be part of the next update so that should make thinks much better :)
PS4 & X1 | C: MS | XIM4 | FW: the latest ofc! :) | Mon: BenQ XL2420Z | Pad: Zowie G-SR | KB: Ducky DK1008L Cherry Red O-Rings| A: AKG K701 Creative X7 Antlion Modmic | M: Zowie EC1-A | D: 3200 | P: 1000hz | BF4 4 HIP: 35 ADS: 20

My Fortnite Creator Code: beamimpact
Check out my Youtube Channel: XIMGameplay

Offline Web-head

  • MVP
  • *
  • Posts: 2134
    • View Profile
  • PSN ID: Spidey
Re: OBsIV ... couple of questions? (For Advanced Xim players)
« Reply #652 on: 08:37 AM - 06/27/16 »
Didn't see this until late Sunday night, and I just wanted to play and not have to test.  Going to test tonight, though.  I've read all the impressions on this build and I just want to be sure. 

OBsIV, can you confirm that this build is doing the same thing as the last in terms of smoothing mouse movements?  In other words, as you increase Boost, you increase smoothing, except now in all directions as opposed to just Horizontal?

The feedback is all over the place on this build where the last was a clear consensus.  I understand not wanting to bias the test subjects (lol) by telling them what they could expect initially, so that you can see if what you did is really working as intended, but at this point with people having opinions that are in opposite spectrums, I think it would be beneficial if you outlined:

What you are doing with this build compared to the last?

What results were you expecting in terms of Low/High Boost and how it would impact AA?

What were you expecting the consensus to be in terms of Boost number?  As an example, you said last build you expected most to settle on 85?

If this build is doing the same thing as the last, but for all Vectors, why did you say that our previous Boost settings are null and void?

We all really appreciate the work that you've put in on every aspect of XIM, and I know that you have other fish to fry.  I'm going to test this build and I'm more than happy to, but I think at this point after a few days of everyone getting their feet wet with it, it's counterproductive to not outline exactly what's happening or what the full extent of the Boost setting is in this build.  No trade secrets obviously.  Doesn't need to be that technical, but after about 3 days and 10 pages, it still seems like people can't agree on key fundamental points of what this build is even doing.

Thanks

Offline OBsIV

  • Administrator
  • MVP
  • *
  • Posts: 38084
  • It's obsessive.
    • View Profile
    • OBsIV's Blog
Re: OBsIV ... couple of questions? (For Advanced Xim players)
« Reply #653 on: 09:16 AM - 06/27/16 »
It's important to let people know that nothing was done specially targeting AA. Changing the intensity value (overridden Boost value) doesn't map to an effect with AA. I didn't do a big analysis on AA. Rather, I took peoples' feedback on STv1 vs. STv2, comments about how controller feels with AA vs. mouse, feedback from the first test firmware, and the many descriptions of how this felt and built a new Steady Aim that I felt matched all this data. So I don't have any data or even opinions about general expectations around how you should expect AA to be effected since anyone's play style is different (which means AA affects them differently). All I can suggest is trying out different values and seeing how it feels to you.
Get the most out of your XIM APEX, read the XIM APEX Support FAQ.

Offline RML

  • MVP
  • *
  • Posts: 6608
  • Live Different
    • View Profile
Re: OBsIV ... couple of questions? (For Advanced Xim players)
« Reply #654 on: 09:34 AM - 06/27/16 »
The reason it feels like it's a spike in sensitivity is because there are actually fewer possible aiming vectors possible as intensity goes up. It's being more aggressive in holding your aim steady so it'll feel like it's higher sensitivity even though it's not. You are still at the same "effective" sensitivity.

Web-head, I believe he pretty much answered the question right there. I apologize if I created any confusion with my post (maybe I'll delete it, if I still can). That added feel of acceleration as you raise the ratio threw some of us for a loop. You'll see what I mean when you test it out.

I assure you though, Stability does intensify as you raise the ratio. However, that feel of added acceleration almost negates the sensation of intensifying AA. You actually have to lower your sensitivity to tell that AA feels stronger as you raise the ratio.

EDIT: I cleaned up my prior post to avoid confusion.


« Last Edit: 09:43 AM - 06/27/16 by RML »

Offline Od1n

  • Global Moderator
  • MVP
  • *
  • Posts: 30810
    • View Profile
Re: OBsIV ... couple of questions? (For Advanced Xim players)
« Reply #655 on: 09:43 AM - 06/27/16 »
id say a XIM AA-Feature and a XIM Anti-AA-Feature can be tackled at some other point
(demand for both is there as seen in this topic)

the steady aim itself does what it should do pretty well, id call it a success
for better usage id really suggest to change the value scale from -100 to +100 though
positive side effect of it you can slightly decrease AA with low values and slightly increase AA with higher values so those who want a XIM AA/Anti-AA Feature have something to play with in the meantime
PS4 & X1 | C: MS | XIM4 | FW: the latest ofc! :) | Mon: BenQ XL2420Z | Pad: Zowie G-SR | KB: Ducky DK1008L Cherry Red O-Rings| A: AKG K701 Creative X7 Antlion Modmic | M: Zowie EC1-A | D: 3200 | P: 1000hz | BF4 4 HIP: 35 ADS: 20

My Fortnite Creator Code: beamimpact
Check out my Youtube Channel: XIMGameplay

Offline Web-head

  • MVP
  • *
  • Posts: 2134
    • View Profile
  • PSN ID: Spidey
Re: OBsIV ... couple of questions? (For Advanced Xim players)
« Reply #656 on: 10:02 AM - 06/27/16 »
The reason it feels like it's a spike in sensitivity is because there are actually fewer possible aiming vectors possible as intensity goes up. It's being more aggressive in holding your aim steady so it'll feel like it's higher sensitivity even though it's not. You are still at the same "effective" sensitivity.

Web-head, I believe he pretty much answered the question right there. I apologize if I created any confusion with my post (maybe I'll delete it, if I still can). That added feel of acceleration as you raise the ratio threw some of us for a loop. You'll see what I mean when you test it out.

I assure you though, Stability does intensify as you raise the ratio. However, that feel of added acceleration almost negates the sensation of intensifying AA. You actually have to lower your sensitivity to tell that AA feels stronger as you raise the ratio.

EDIT: I cleaned up my prior post to avoid confusion.

It's not only you that is creating the confusion.  There have been several people that say they feel more AA in the upper boost ranges, and then those that feel more AA in the lower Boost ranges.  It's a bit of a mess even without the clarification of why people feel a speed increase.

Offline Web-head

  • MVP
  • *
  • Posts: 2134
    • View Profile
  • PSN ID: Spidey
Re: OBsIV ... couple of questions? (For Advanced Xim players)
« Reply #657 on: 10:09 AM - 06/27/16 »
It's important to let people know that nothing was done specially targeting AA. Changing the intensity value (overridden Boost value) doesn't map to an effect with AA. I didn't do a big analysis on AA. Rather, I took peoples' feedback on STv1 vs. STv2, comments about how controller feels with AA vs. mouse, feedback from the first test firmware, and the many descriptions of how this felt and built a new Steady Aim that I felt matched all this data. So I don't have any data or even opinions about general expectations around how you should expect AA to be effected since anyone's play style is different (which means AA affects them differently). All I can suggest is trying out different values and seeing how it feels to you.

Forget my wording about AA then.  Forget the questions that I asked as well.

Again, I'm very happy to test the build, and I will regardless, but with Boost operating on a scale of 0-100 for BOTH ADS and Hip, that is a lot of variables to test.  Especially given that according to you on your last build, that you didn't expect us to really see any impact until the 80 Boost range.  So I could be testing a lot of numbers for no reason.

The only thing that I think we absolutely need to know is this statement from you:

As you move from a value of 0-100 on Boost _________ happens.  (Where the blank is filled in by what this Steady Aim Build is doing and whether that effect increases or decreases as you go from 0 to 100)

As long as you answer that, and I know what the Boost is actually affecting, and whether it increases or decreases said effect as you go up in Boost range, then I will know what I need to set, and more importantly, I will know that the results are not in my head.

Offline Mark8010

  • Member
  • *
  • Posts: 160
    • View Profile
Re: OBsIV ... couple of questions? (For Advanced Xim players)
« Reply #658 on: 10:28 AM - 06/27/16 »
Personally I preferred the previous SA firmware ( in fact I still prefer St1 overall)

I don't see why increasing the stability gives a feeling of added acceleration and requires a decrease in sensitivity - if anything it should be the opposite.

For me, SA should be a relatively minor setting that requires tweaking once you're happy with the main settings. But it doesn't, it requires a whole reworking of curves and sensitivity values which is rather frustrating given the hours it takes to make the standard ST's usable for games like Destiny.

The XIM product is in danger of becoming too complicated for it's own good IMO.

Offline OBsIV

  • Administrator
  • MVP
  • *
  • Posts: 38084
  • It's obsessive.
    • View Profile
    • OBsIV's Blog
Re: OBsIV ... couple of questions? (For Advanced Xim players)
« Reply #659 on: 10:45 AM - 06/27/16 »
As you move from a value of 0-100 on Boost _________ happens.

As you move from a value of 0-100 on Boost the system becomes more aggressive at holding your aim velocity and direction (vector) constant.

Get the most out of your XIM APEX, read the XIM APEX Support FAQ.


Admin