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XIM 4 => XIM 4 Discussions => Topic started by: kool_kid909 on 08:01 PM - 06/25/17

Title: is there a anti recoil thing for xim 4?
Post by: kool_kid909 on 08:01 PM - 06/25/17
is there a anti-recoil or no recoil for xim 4 for rainbow 6 siege and if so how do i use it or set it up? if anyone could help me out id appreciate it thanks.
Title: Re: is there a anti recoil thing for xim 4?
Post by: jalalsami_87 on 03:36 AM - 06/26/17
For me I adjust the xy ratio in ADS for Black ops 3 and it works well 0.60
Title: Re: is there a anti recoil thing for xim 4?
Post by: Frash brang on 06:47 AM - 06/26/17
no anti recoil in XIM. You need a Titan one device in order to perform Anti recoil
Title: Re: is there a anti recoil thing for xim 4?
Post by: kool_kid909 on 12:12 PM - 06/26/17
Is there one for Titan two because I plan on getting that. Also am I able to use the Titan two with xim 4 with mouse and keyboard?
Title: Re: is there a anti recoil thing for xim 4?
Post by: Frash brang on 03:52 PM - 06/26/17
Yes you can. The only thing that didn't work with my titan 1/xim set up dad the mic/headphones. I had to buy a wireless turtle beach head set. Not sure if titan 2 sorts that issue.
What game are you hoping to anti recoil on?
Title: Re: is there a anti recoil thing for xim 4?
Post by: kool_kid909 on 04:30 PM - 06/26/17
Oh ok. Right now I have wireless turtle beach headsets too but has a usb transmitter and optical cable to connect. It's the 800 series kinda like the Astros a50's. I'm hoping to get it for cods or rainbow six siege but I'm not sure if there is a certain script for each game or if any anti recoil script works with any game?
Title: Re: is there a anti recoil thing for xim 4?
Post by: full58 on 07:36 PM - 06/26/17
Yeah,  it functions much like when you pull down on the thumb stick,  with xim you pull down with your mouse
Title: Re: is there a anti recoil thing for xim 4?
Post by: kool_kid909 on 10:05 PM - 06/26/17
Well I know that you do that to reduce recoil yourself but I'm saying something that can do it for you.
Title: Re: is there a anti recoil thing for xim 4?
Post by: Supernatural X on 11:11 PM - 06/26/17
Well I know that you do that to reduce recoil yourself but I'm saying something that can do it for you.

You have to get a Titan One and setup the script yourself for anti-recoil, the Xim, on it's own doesn't support an anti-recoil system
Title: Re: is there a anti recoil thing for xim 4?
Post by: kool_kid909 on 11:29 PM - 06/26/17
Oh ok. Is there a script already made for Titan 2 though maybe? Because I have no idea how to script lol. So I was wondering if there's some made already for rainbow or if any anti recoil works with any game.
Title: Re: is there a anti recoil thing for xim 4?
Post by: Supernatural X on 12:14 AM - 06/27/17
Oh ok. Is there a script already made for Titan 2 though maybe? Because I have no idea how to script lol. So I was wondering if there's some made already for rainbow or if any anti recoil works with any game.

I don't have a Titan One or Two, I would recommend messaging Ant1th3s1s, he knows a lot about the Titan devices.
Title: Re: is there a anti recoil thing for xim 4?
Post by: kool_kid909 on 01:32 AM - 06/27/17
Ok cool thanks. Will do.
Title: Re: is there a anti recoil thing for xim 4?
Post by: piiwii on 02:10 AM - 06/27/17
Yes T2 fixes the headphone problem, but not sure when you pair it with a XIM4. I use wireless headphones so I haven't had a chance to try this yet.
Title: Re: is there a anti recoil thing for xim 4?
Post by: TSARGA on 02:14 AM - 06/27/17
Anti recoil is actually illegal.
Title: Re: is there a anti recoil thing for xim 4?
Post by: kool_kid909 on 03:16 AM - 06/27/17
Dang is it really? I doubt that it's even traceable since it's hard to tell if you're using it or a real skill player.
Title: Re: is there a anti recoil thing for xim 4?
Post by: Supernatural X on 07:59 AM - 06/27/17
Dang is it really? I doubt that it's even traceable since it's hard to tell if you're using it or a real skill player.

Yes it is banable and it's also blatantly obvious if you have 0 recoil via the anti recoil.
Title: Re: is there a anti recoil thing for xim 4?
Post by: kool_kid909 on 03:19 PM - 06/27/17
Oh alright then. Has anyone been banned from it?
Title: Re: is there a anti recoil thing for xim 4?
Post by: Supernatural X on 09:01 PM - 06/27/17
Oh alright then. Has anyone been banned from it?

People on Xbox 360 used to get banned from using anti recoil modded controllers.
Title: Re: is there a anti recoil thing for xim 4?
Post by: kool_kid909 on 12:12 AM - 06/28/17
Dang. Well I think it's kinda hard to see especially on a game like rainbow where almost everything is broken. Ping abuser and stuff. I think that's a thing People wouldn't see when there's other issues that are worse like hit detection lol.
Title: Re: is there a anti recoil thing for xim 4?
Post by: Od1n on 10:29 AM - 06/28/17
Dang is it really? I doubt that it's even traceable since it's hard to tell if you're using it or a real skill player.

Yes it is banable and it's also blatantly obvious if you have 0 recoil via the anti recoil.

thats why a clever player would never reduce recoil by 100% with a script, set it to eg 80% recoil reduction and the remaining 20% come from your own mouse which will make it look a bit inconsistant and therefore legit
Title: Re: is there a anti recoil thing for xim 4?
Post by: kool_kid909 on 02:26 PM - 06/28/17
Yeah.  that's what my thought of what I was gonna do. Thanks for the info.
Title: Re: is there a anti recoil thing for xim 4?
Post by: omega4 on 10:57 PM - 06/28/17
I believe that a product like the XIM4 is NOT cheating, since it serves as a "translator" of sorts between a mouse/keyboard and console controller. I'm also grateful that the XIM4 does NOT offer functions which ARE cheating (e.g. an anti-recoil script).

Personally, I get a little uncomfortable when I see forum members here discussing how to implement cheats without being detected (e.g. anti-recoil). I think it goes against the spirit for which the XIM4 was intended and only serves to fuel the criticisms levied against the XIM4 (that it's a cheating device).

If the XIM4 device was intended to be a "cheating" device, then I stand corrected and will shut up.
Title: Re: is there a anti recoil thing for xim 4?
Post by: Frash brang on 01:25 AM - 06/29/17
You won't get banned because anti recoil is actually not that effective. It doesn't make you a God at games, it's not like aimbot or wall hack infact it can cause inconsistencies in your aiming (although greatly improved since the first anti recoil scripts were created)

Yes there are scripts for you to download and use, just search for them in the script library on the titan 1 website.

I spent a long time looking into anti recoil using various methods, trying many scripts, talking to many people.... Was it worth it? Well I'll let you be the judge but my titan 1 isn't connected to my xim4 right now.

Tsarga - you are the biggest troll on this forum :)
Title: Re: is there a anti recoil thing for xim 4?
Post by: Od1n on 12:22 PM - 06/29/17
You won't get banned because anti recoil is actually not that effective.

it doesnt matter if its effective or not, its against the terms of service on XBL and therefore gets you banned
PSN seems to have removed the scripting clause as of lately so its unsure how they handle it, but until like one year ago it was also directly mentioned in their ToS that scriping or macroing gets you banned

if you record a killcam of someone using an obvious rapidifre script and you send that to sony or microsoft that person is usually banned pretty quickly
Title: Re: is there a anti recoil thing for xim 4?
Post by: kool_kid909 on 07:09 PM - 06/29/17
Well I know it isn't aimbot or walls and I don't want it to be. Just want something that could bring a high recoil down so it can be usable and do better with it. And maybe there are better scripts in Titan 2 for anti recoil which is what I'm going to get just since it's the newest and wouldn't want to upgrade later on. I've seen videos of anti recoil and it looks like it works completely how it should work.
Title: Re: is there a anti recoil thing for xim 4?
Post by: omega4 on 08:11 PM - 06/29/17
Well I know it isn't aimbot or walls and I don't want it to be. Just want something that could bring a high recoil down so it can be usable and do better with it. And maybe there are better scripts in Titan 2 for anti recoil which is what I'm going to get just since it's the newest and wouldn't want to upgrade later on. I've seen videos of anti recoil and it looks like it works completely how it should work.

Not sure how old you are but you're still missing the point of what others are saying. A cheat includes aimbots, wallhacks, AND anti-recoil scripts.

Since you know that these things don't work with the XIM4, you could enjoy this fine product for what it does offer.
Title: Re: is there a anti recoil thing for xim 4?
Post by: Frash brang on 02:51 AM - 06/30/17
Koolkid,

This topic is like a red rag to a bull for some people so Pm me if you want any help with this.  It'll keep the peice. The irony is they all use a product that potentially improves aiming in some games yet get all flustered over a macro that is bound by the same in game limitations.

Title: Re: is there a anti recoil thing for xim 4?
Post by: omega4 on 06:34 AM - 06/30/17
Koolkid,

This topic is like a red rag to a bull for some people so Pm me if you want any help with this.  It'll keep the peice. The irony is they all use a product that potentially improves aiming in some games yet get all flustered over a macro that is bound by the same in game limitations.

Personally, I think the real irony is that some gamers don't realize that mouse/keyboard is actually sanctioned by both Microsoft and Sony (via third party licensing). Anti-recoil scripts and other cheats are NOT.
Title: Re: is there a anti recoil thing for xim 4?
Post by: Frash brang on 11:54 AM - 06/30/17
A xim4 user mad about anti recoil lol

Go to an overwatch console reddit post and tell them you use xim4 and see what they think of your gaming "morals"

Have you even used anti recoil?

Title: Re: is there a anti recoil thing for xim 4?
Post by: kool_kid909 on 12:21 PM - 06/30/17
Alright cool. Thanks frashbang. I'll pm you. And I do know it's a cheat or what ever but it's not like a kb/m doesn't give you an advantage either. I play rainbow pretty much everyday and my friend always blames the other team of using kb/m even though they might not be using one since it's hard for him to believe you can be that good on a controller since he isn't a horrible player himself.
Title: Re: is there a anti recoil thing for xim 4?
Post by: manaus on 06:21 AM - 07/02/17
A xim4 user mad about anti recoil lol

Go to an overwatch console reddit post and tell them you use xim4 and see what they think of your gaming "morals"

Have you even used anti recoil?

Of course he is mad, I am too...you come up with something that gives extra and extra advantage on top of Xim4  8) ;)

You know what...I am doing that too...as soon as I am back playing again, I will buy a T2 and will do that  ;D

I know its not fair, but a lot of ppl use it...
Title: Re: is there a anti recoil thing for xim 4?
Post by: digital blasphemy on 07:43 PM - 07/02/17
Ya its called you arm.
Title: Re: is there a anti recoil thing for xim 4?
Post by: TSARGA on 05:20 AM - 07/06/17
A xim4 user mad about anti recoil lol
Anti-recoil is cheating, so it shouldn't even be mentioned on this forum.

Go to an overwatch console reddit post and tell them you use xim4 and see what they think of your gaming "morals"
what
Title: Re: is there a anti recoil thing for xim 4?
Post by: antithesis on 04:46 AM - 07/07/17
In my experience, anti-recoil is typically more trouble than its worth. All it does is automate the downward (and sometimes left or right) pull of a stick or mouse while firing to recentre your reticle on a target. It's barely worth calling a cheat, particularly considering the inconsistencies of aiming with anti-recoil active where you're largely locked into a predetermined movement pattern whether you like it or not.

Anti-recoil can do a decent enough job of controlling bullet spread, but you'll rarely fully eliminate recoil, particularly if it's randomised due to reticle bloom, or when you're tracking a moving target. Controlled burst-fire, in-game weapon mods and manual aim tends to do a better job than an anti-recoil script, whilst maintaining full reticle control throughout.

I've written probably the best Titan One anti-recoil script to use with a Xim, but I don't use it myself. I'd rather choose a weapon that feels good with a Xim and manually adapt to its recoil pattern. Knowing where to land the first shot for the last to hit the head is a lot easier than wrestling for control over the reticle when you need it most.

In the end, it really depends on the game you're playing and how comfortable you are with your load-out. Anti-recoil does help quite a bit in some games with some weapons, but it's completely useless in others.

if you record a killcam of someone using an obvious rapidifre script and you send that to sony or microsoft that person is usually banned pretty quickly
The chances of that are slim to none. Sony and MS has better things to do with their money than chase someone using a rapid-fire script. The only risk is when you're doing something a game engine is otherwise incapable of doing. This typically involves a jitter mod where a reload animation is intentionally disrupted to increase fire-rate, or spamming ADS to improve aim assist, which is frankly nauseating. Either mod is a really easy tell that you're intentionally exploiting a flaw in the game rather than automating controller input and if you do get caught doing it, it's your own stupid fault.

Not sure how old you are but you're still missing the point of what others are saying. A cheat includes aimbots, wallhacks, AND anti-recoil scripts.
Anti-recoil may be considered cheating, but aimbots and wallhacks are a completely different kettle of fish. They tap directly into the game engine to aim for you, something that's not possible on a (non-hacked) console, nor via a Titan One, Titan Two, Cronus Max or Xim Commander script.

You still have to aim properly while using anti-recoil, it just knocks some of the recoil buffeting off for you by automating a degree of X&Y axis stick movement, at the risk that you'll overshoot, undershoot or lose reticle control at a critical moment. Like rapid-fire, anti-recoil can help by focusing you more on the next shot than the last, but it can't plant a bullet in the enemy's head for you.

Whether you use mod scripts or not is entirely up to you. No-one needs to know, it doesn't dramatically affect the outcome (unless it's a blatant jitter mod) and no-one else here really has the right to judge the morality of doing it on a console m/kb forum. I write some pretty well-received Titan and CM mod scripts, more to improve my own user experience than anything, and I share them simply to provide folks with decent tools to make their own decision.
Title: Re: is there a anti recoil thing for xim 4?
Post by: piiwii on 09:35 PM - 07/07/17
I don't use anti-recoil scripts, but I use rapid fire. Because of my carpel tunnel, it kills my wrist to use pistols, DMR's or any semi-auto weapon that requires repeated tapping of the same button. I need it simply to prevent intense physical pain from building up in my arm. I think this is a fair use of the technology:)
Title: Re: is there a anti recoil thing for xim 4?
Post by: omega4 on 10:47 AM - 07/08/17
I couldn't care less if other gamers want to cheat with anti-recoil scripts and rationalize their behavior with semantics.

However,  I would be disappointed if the XIM4 gets its name "dragged through the mud" by all this talk.
Title: Re: is there a anti recoil thing for xim 4?
Post by: GenericPlayground on 02:05 PM - 07/10/17
You still have to aim properly while using anti-recoil, it just knocks some of the recoil buffeting off for you by automating a degree of X&Y axis stick movement

Unfortunately you are arguing with yourself. Aiming properly means controlling recoil. If you have to use a script to help with controlling recoil you aren't aiming properly.
Title: Re: is there a anti recoil thing for xim 4?
Post by: xKowal86x on 05:11 PM - 07/10/17
Dont want to offended any one but all scripts like that for me is just sad,dont get me wrong,controller players call xim user cheaters,but is becouse they never use xim.Im never ever before play m/kb and when i buy it i knowed that not make my aim god or anything just want to try how its feel play mouse.I still mastering my mouse and im not aim god but what i love in mouse is freedom.Finaly my aim is something what i control,no stupid accelaeration like in destiny and all that @#$%.When i die its only my foult cant blame controller and analog aiming.Love that thing.And be honest use xim 6 weeks and recoil is much easier to control.and i love mastering realy hard kicking guns.Anti recoil scripts are just sad.If you play m/kb agains controler users and use that...sorry but you realy dont care to be better you just want have best k/d in easier way without put time and practice to master your own skill.And mastering recoil and learn guns how they kick with mouse for me is just plesure:)
Title: Re: is there a anti recoil thing for xim 4?
Post by: antithesis on 08:41 AM - 07/13/17
Unfortunately you are arguing with yourself. Aiming properly means controlling recoil. If you have to use a script to help with controlling recoil you aren't aiming properly.

I agree, which is why I don't use anti-recoil myself. You either adapt to the recoil pattern of the gun, or you adapt to the anti-recoil pattern of the script. IMO, the former is more predictable than the latter and it's easier to find a weapon that works with one's tools and play-style than attempt to patch up shortcomings with a script that will ultimately disappoint because you still can't aim for @#$%.

I do however provide the option for those who want it, mostly because everything else sucked and no-one could get it right for the Xim. I've come close, but it's still imperfect and does require time to tweak on a per-weapon and weapon mod basis that I personally can't be arsed putting into most games.

The only example I can provide where anti-recoil has been obviously beneficial is in Garden Warfare. The fire-rate of the Law Pea is unrestricted by the game engine, but it comes at the cost of high recoil. Using rapid-fire and dialling in anti-recoil so two full magazines can be dumped into your opponent's head in under a second will knock over anything, but you need to be careful to line up the shot in the first place or you're dead meat. Nothing on a console can point the gun in the right direction for you if your shot is off and anti-recoil will hurt more than it helps if that's the case.

If you play m/kb agains controler users and use that...sorry but you realy dont care to be better you just want have best k/d in easier way without put time and practice to master your own skill.And mastering recoil and learn guns how they kick with mouse for me is just plesure:)

No argument there either. Most people who want anti-recoil scripts are looking for a shortcut to get one up on their opposition and to ultimately buff their k/d. But aren't games supposed to be about having fun? That sounds more like work to me. If a dude beats me to the punch, that's my cue to git gud and that more than anything is a simple investment of time.

I write scripts for fun just as much as I (used to) like building gaming rigs for fun, or modding PC games for fun, or using a mouse & keyboard on console for fun. It's more about customising and improving the experience than cheating. If you sucked before using anti-recoil, you'll suck afterwards...

Buying a Scuf, wearing surround sound cans, getting faster internet, using a lower lag screen, noise cancelling / enhancing weapon mods...they're all part of the same toolkit to get an arguably unfair advantage over your opponents. Most, if not all of us, have done at least one or more, as has everyone trying to shoot you in the head in whichever brown, drab war simulator floats your boat.

Exhibit A - Xim m/kb adapter. The "holier than thou" argument kinda falls on it arse when you're guilty of the same offence ;) Unless cheating is blatant exploitation and/or malicious (DDoS, lag-switching, wall-hacking, aim-bots etc), just accept it is as part of the game.

If you're good enough, it won't make a sh!t-lick of difference being on either end of a mod script. And if you're not good enough, a mod script can help level the playing field and smooth the learning curve against more experienced and better-equipped opposition. Everyone deserves a fair crack, it's disheartening to constantly get your @#$% handed to you.

Don't approve, don't do it, but don't pretend that you're not doing the same thing too by using a Xim. Whenever there's a whiff of improving aim assist with a funky curve or a firmware update, the forums here go apesh!t. My objective is much simpler than being king of peeny island - I really like that Xims and Titans go together like ham and cheese, like rum and coke, like pickles and restaurant ceilings, and enjoy the simple challenge of making a game play better.

However,  I would be disappointed if the XIM4 gets its name "dragged through the mud" by all this talk.

Xim's name is already mud to anyone who hasn't used one. The lack of direct mod support on the Xim keeps some of that from sticking, but indirect support will always be an option for those who seek it out. And it should be possible too because there's always some poor guy out there with one less limb than you who deserves a shot at playing the same games. I'm far more willing to help that guy than someone who wants me to hold their hand.
Title: Re: is there a anti recoil thing for xim 4?
Post by: xKowal86x on 10:34 AM - 07/13/17
Right so you say if some one kill you loads game is not fun so use scripts just to have fun?if he best you meaning his better and agains his skill you need use anti recoil?
Really?Everything just to make better k/d ratio.So if you be kill some one loads of time he don't be have fun so maybe he use some aimbot just to beat you and have fun.Control recoil is not hard mate I'm 31 years old average player and I'm still ok with that.
Is not hard job you just play and get better.
Don't get me wrong but any one who use scripts like anti recoil and oil that stuff for like you say "having fun" is just cheater that it.If playing against console players and still need anything what do job for you becouse you don't want waste time just stop playing fps and go play maincraft.
No offence is my opinion.Just make me angre ppl use everything just to win.That's not fun at all.
Title: Re: is there a anti recoil thing for xim 4?
Post by: antithesis on 12:54 AM - 07/15/17
Right so you say if some one kill you loads game is not fun so use scripts just to have fun?if he best you meaning his better and agains his skill you need use anti recoil?
Really?Everything just to make better k/d ratio.So if you be kill some one loads of time he don't be have fun so maybe he use some aimbot just to beat you and have fun.Control recoil is not hard mate I'm 31 years old average player and I'm still ok with that.
Is not hard job you just play and get better.
Don't get me wrong but any one who use scripts like anti recoil and oil that stuff for like you say "having fun" is just cheater that it.If playing against console players and still need anything what do job for you becouse you don't want waste time just stop playing fps and go play maincraft.
No offence is my opinion.Just make me angre ppl use everything just to win.That's not fun at all.

For people who aren't used to m/kb, can't aim with a controller (scripts aren't just for m/kb), or just suck at games, yes - getting shot in the head repeatedly is not fun. So they seek this sort of thing out, and there are a lot of them out there.

Myself, no, I don't need the help. I'm 45 and grew up in the Doom, Quake, Unreal Tournament, Half-life, Counter-strike era. I've been playing shooters since there were shooters. My aim's still pinpoint with m/kb and my reflexes aren't shot either. But I can't hit the side of a barn using a controller, so my reason for using a Xim is just the desire for more familiar, comfortable controls. But in doing so, that alone does provide an advantage over most other players, so the moral highground is pretty low around here.

As I said, I have no need of anti-recoil myself, but I'm happy to help those who do. They're looking for something to help them, regardless of my personal position or experience on the subject. I'd rather provide good tools than bad to those who can't otherwise compete in games that toss out easy-mode gear to experienced players like candy while putting peashooters in the hands of noobs. Constantly dying is no fun for them and those doing the killing don't need the help, so I'm ok with folks wanting a level playing-field to get them off the ground and keep them playing a game.

To me, scripting is about the challenge of learning and the using a game's mechanics to create an easier experience for those who want it. A simple example is Titan Skating in Destiny - everyone can do it, but button-mashing is an unnecessary ball-ache when simply holding a button could do the same thing. It's a user experience thing, not a game-breaking exploit. That's not in the same realm as aimbots, wallhacks or lag-switches - many of us play on console these days to avoid them on PC.

If you or I don't need the help, that's fine, we'll still have fun using our mice to pluck heads on a platform that doesn't natively support those controls ??? But don't shut the door on those who do want more help by pushing them down the Minecraft shaft.

Besides, anti-recoil is practically useless in most games and of very limited use in others, so don't overblow it. Try it yourself and prepare to be underwhelmed - the benefit of managing recoil is outweighed by a loss of reticle control. Just like ballistics curves on Xim, it's best done in moderation.
Title: Re: is there a anti recoil thing for xim 4?
Post by: xKowal86x on 03:12 AM - 07/15/17
Sorry I be if any one can't learn aim and need cheat is simply sad and pathetic.Is my opinion.Scripts just to be better are cheating that ppl don't should be play games like for.What if you suck in raicing game need scriprs to?Omg sorry is stupid for me.
Oh btw maybe because I say that you think I'm amazing player,I'm not I'm average player.
My first for was destiny but is lagging game,real fps was bo3.And let me tell you for first week ppl wreck me like kd 3-20.But I didn't cry just play and learn game,take myself for dark matter camo and with time my kd rise.In the end in most game i finish top 2 with us 2.0-3.0.But still sometime I play against good players and they wreck me.That don't mean I do everything even cheat just to kill them cuz is sad.Just play game and slowly you get better,maybe not pro lvl but good enought to have fun from playing.Also never use mouse before xim but still willing to learn insted cheat just to feel better.
Never change my mind if you have mouse against controller and still need use cheats just stop playing fps games.That's selfish and you killing fun for ppl who decide to learn play game and get good with aim
Title: Re: is there a anti recoil thing for xim 4?
Post by: antithesis on 05:26 AM - 07/15/17
I don't disagree, but I also don't condemn those who want to do it. Live and let live...

And before you condemn, you really should know first-hand what scripts do. Just like a mouse, they won't turn you into a gaming god, they just smooth out some rough gameplay edges, or they do nothing at all.

The only thing I regularly use in all shooters is auto-fire on semi-auto weapons because I hate button-mashing. The bullets don't shoot faster and I can't do anything no-one else can do when using a regular controller, I just don't trash my mouse or my fingers by clicking buttons unnecessarily. Is that really cheating? Not a great deal more than using a mouse on console. Does it affect anyone else's game? I don't think so, especially when an in-game gun mod does the same thing.
Title: Re: is there a anti recoil thing for xim 4?
Post by: xKowal86x on 08:16 AM - 07/15/17
Right you now saying you agree is cheating but also if some one want to use is his choice.Yes that true but that not change that is CHEATING! !! Anti recoil compensate recoil so you have less recoil isn't?Yes so how that is not cheating?For game designs diffrent guns to different  play style some have low recoil and are good for longer range fights some like smgs with very high rate of fire and they melt everything in close,mid range but have big recoil.That's how's weapons work.If you reduce that recoil is not so big problem and is easier to aim and mid him fight start to be even easier to win.That's cheating simply maybe not change you in good gamer but help.Is not how him should be act when developer create game.
Now by saying auto fire you mean rapid fire?That's cheating to why?you know why scrip be alweys shot your bullet in perfect time exactly what is weapon rate of fire.If you do that by click or press button sometime you can press to fast or to slow that cost your weapon firing slower.With auto you don't have that problem and you be shot faster most of the time then other player use same gun.Again is cheating.Don't buy story's about don't like press mouse and other.Mouse button are designe to press 20 milion times and even more.
Everything what is added to game and help and is not intended by developer is simply cheat.Big or small is still cheat.
Ppl can play what ever they want,just be honest say it's cheat and don't find accused that some ppl can't aim,they don't have fun because they die cuz that is one big  @#$%.
Ppl like that can't play and try do everything to win with some one who play game learn map,practice aim and outsmart them.What give them fun using cheats killing spirit of playing games
Title: Re: is there a anti recoil thing for xim 4?
Post by: TSARGA on 11:23 AM - 07/15/17
I don't disagree, but I also don't condemn those who want to do it. Live and let live...

And before you condemn, you really should know first-hand what scripts do. Just like a mouse, they won't turn you into a gaming god, they just smooth out some rough gameplay edges, or they do nothing at all.
But we need to condemn them because it's illegal. Key sequencing is illegal (as opposed to key switching and modulators which are legal).

Quote
Exploitation of macros is forbidden and may result in account suspension or revocation.
(https://rainbow6.ubisoft.com/siege/en-us/news/detail.aspx?c=tcm:152-249092-16&ct=tcm:148-76770-32)

Definition:
Quote
A single, user-defined command that is part of an application and executes a series of commands.
(http://www.thefreedictionary.com/macro)

I don't use anti-recoil scripts, but I use rapid fire. Because of my carpel tunnel, it kills my wrist to use pistols, DMR's or any semi-auto weapon that requires repeated tapping of the same button. I need it simply to prevent intense physical pain from building up in my arm. I think this is a fair use of the technology:)
It's not a fair use since it's illegal.
Title: Re: is there a anti recoil thing for xim 4?
Post by: antithesis on 11:32 PM - 07/16/17
Using an unlicensed m/kb adapter masking itself as a third-party official controller to prevent detection and a possible device ban on consoles that don't natively support mouse controls... cheating or not? Survey the general gaming public, how do you think they'll respond? Do a search for Xim on any gaming forum or website and you'll find the answer pretty quickly. That moral highground you're pitching your tents on is looking pretty shaky.

Rapid-fire and anti-recoil are very lightweight mods compared to hacks and lag-switches and have little effect on the outcome. Perhaps if you loosened the stick up your arse and tried it yourself, you'd realise it ain't that bad, nor that effective after all, especially against high-level opposition.

That's exactly the same counter-argument we use to defend our Xims against the naysayers who call us cheaters, isn't it? ;) Besides, aren't they packing Scufs and Battle Beavers with access to the same types of "performance" mods?

This isn't a black and white issue, there are all shades of grey. If you were above reproach and insisted on an even playing field, you wouldn't be here in the first place, would you? Keep deluding yourselves into believing you're somehow better because you cheat in a different way...

If you reduce that recoil is not so big problem and is easier to aim and mid him fight start to be even easier to win.
Theoretically, yes. In reality, no.

As I've stated repeatedly, anti-recoil doesn't work particularly well because it locks you into over or undershooting if your target decides to move, which is every gamer ever in a multiplayer lobby. The brain and the hand can easily adapt, but a script programmed to move the reticle down X pixels and across Y pixels cannot.  You end up trading predictable recoil for unpredictable anti-recoil, ergo it's all but useless in multi-player games, but has a place in single-player where bots lack the intelligence to dodge bullets.

The Division is a good case in point. The recoil on guns is really heavy and can be countered pretty well using anti-recoil. But, the second the opponent moves laterally or vertically is the second anti-recoil falls to pieces. So while anti-recoil is effective in single-player against a stationary target, it's really ineffective in multi-player and ultimately hurts rather than helps the player using it.

If you knew what anti-recoil actually does from experience rather than what you think it does from theorycrafting, (just like the unwashed controller masses when discussing the Xim) you'd understand that it's all but useless for multi-player, so there's absolutely no point getting your knickers in a knot. Getting used to and controlling recoil manually is by far the more effective and safer path, particularly given in-game gear mods reduce recoil and can turn semi-auto into auto-fire weapons.

So really, all you end up with is an argument against freeing up a couple of weapon slots and automating tedious button-mashing. That's quality of life stuff, not OMFGBBQ hax0r! Using the pinpoint precision and control of a mouse against the clumsiness of thumb-based analog sticks far outweighs the minor benefit (and potentially significant detriment) of rapid-fire and/or anti-recoil ??? But it also doesn't guarantee the win. Stones and glass houses...

As the Xim should have taught you by now, there's a world of difference between thinking and knowing. That's why I say "live and let live" because in reality, it has close to zero effect on the outcome and any benefit is diminished the higher up the food chain you go.

Exploitation of macros is forbidden and may result in account suspension or revocation.
(https://rainbow6.ubisoft.com/siege/en-us/news/detail.aspx?c=tcm:152-249092-16&ct=tcm:148-76770-32 (https://rainbow6.ubisoft.com/siege/en-us/news/detail.aspx?c=tcm:152-249092-16&ct=tcm:148-76770-32))
<snip>
It's not a fair use since it's illegal.

It's not illegal in the slightest. Show me a single piece of legislation that outlaws the use of macros. If I can't go to jail or be sued for using a macro, then it's not "illegal".

What it is, is considered unethical and ethics vary wildly from person to person. What's right for me may be wrong for you and we'll take opposing or similar stances, depending on the topic of discussion. But using macros is very definitely and has never been "illegal".

Gaming companies provide ethical guidelines about how you're supposed to behave in their games, not legislation resulting in criminal or civil charges.

You'll also note the careful wording of Ubisoft. "Exploitation" of macros is forbidden. That doesn't mean "Use" of macros is forbidden. Exploitation is when you find a flaw in a game engine and use it to your advantage. Jitter mods in Call of Duty are one such example, head-glitching and spawn-camping are others.
Title: Re: is there a anti recoil thing for xim 4?
Post by: TSARGA on 09:34 AM - 07/17/17
It's not illegal in the slightest. Show me a single piece of legislation that outlaws the use of macros. If I can't go to jail or be sued for using a macro, then it's not "illegal".
It's just a figurative term, but I will say "allowed" in order to avoid confusion.

Using an unlicensed m/kb adapter masking itself as a third-party official controller to prevent detection and a possible device ban on consoles that don't natively support mouse controls... cheating or not?
No (the code of conduct says so). Btw it's not about preventing detection, but working. I had a joystick that worked on the same principle on PS3.

Survey the general gaming public, how do you think they'll respond? Do a search for Xim on any gaming forum or website and you'll find the answer pretty quickly.
We could care about that.

Rapid-fire and anti-recoil are very lightweight mods compared to hacks and lag-switches and have little effect on the outcome.
Yes, I do agree with you, but the code of conduct says that it's not allowed.

That's exactly the same counter-argument we use to defend our Xims against the naysayers who call us cheaters, isn't it? ;) Besides, aren't they packing Scufs and Battle Beavers with access to the same types of "performance" mods?

This isn't a black and white issue, there are all shades of grey. If you were above reproach and insisted on an even playing field, you wouldn't be here in the first place, would you? Keep deluding yourselves into believing you're somehow better because you cheat in a different way..
The code of conduct says that macros are not allowed. I don't know the details about Scuf/Battle Beaver hardware, but as long as they have no macros they're allowed.

We are above reproach since the code of conduct says so.

You'll also note the careful wording of Ubisoft. "Exploitation" of macros is forbidden. That doesn't mean "Use" of macros is forbidden. Exploitation is when you find a flaw in a game engine and use it to your advantage. Jitter mods in Call of Duty are one such example, head-glitching and spawn-camping are others.
Definition:
Quote
The action of making use of and benefiting from resources.
(https://en.oxforddictionaries.com/definition/exploitation)

I agree on the fact that many terms in both PlayStation and Ubisoft codes of conduct aren't defined clearly enough, which means that they will have to use the definition that's in favour of the defendant.
Title: Re: is there a anti recoil thing for xim 4?
Post by: antithesis on 06:08 PM - 07/17/17
Survey the general gaming public, how do you think they'll respond? Do a search for Xim on any gaming forum or website and you'll find the answer pretty quickly.
We could care less (sic) about that.

Bingo. There's your answer. If you don't care what they think about a Xim (it is perceived as a cheating device), then why should those who use basic mod scripts care about what you think?

From a "legal" perspective, you are right. Yes, it's "wrong" within the parameters of the EULA, and yes it's "cheating" within those same definitions, but it's an acceptable amount of risk because the potential damage caused is negligible and the risk of being banned is close to zero.

Unless you're exploiting the game engine (which is really up to developers to fix), or deliberately harming the experience of others (a big no-no like lag-switching, DDoS etc), getting banned by breaking the PSN/XBL code of conduct or a game's T&C is not worth a nanosecond of thought.

From an ethical perspective, you can get banned for using a Xim in multiplayer competition that explicitly precludes m/kb from use to participate, but does that stop you from using a Xim for pub-stomping? Does your  Xim really make such a significant negative impact to everyone else's experience that you consider it unethical and go back to using a controller? I dare say you don't give a [email protected] what anyone else in the game thinks, as long as you're enhancing your own experience and not blatantly damaging anyone else's in the process.

Sony, MS, publishers and developers have better ways to spend their limited resources than hunting down mod script users. If mod scripting was a serious problem, surely Sony and MS would try to block it at the device level rather than target individual end-users. Until that happens, I'll continue to care less.

Besides, simple randomisation can mask the otherwise perfect synchronicity of rapid-fire or degree of anti-recoil while not impacting the effect, so there's no way to actually prove that I'm not a wizard with my thumbs, even with the appropriate telemetry to measure my game input.
Title: Re: is there a anti recoil thing for xim 4?
Post by: Frash brang on 04:44 AM - 07/18/17
Well articulate antithesis.
Title: Re: is there a anti recoil thing for xim 4?
Post by: TSARGA on 09:56 AM - 07/19/17
Bingo. There's your answer. If you don't care what they think about a Xim (it is perceived as a cheating device), then why should those who use basic mod scripts care about what you think?
But the XIM isn't and will never be perceived as a cheating device. You are referring to a loud minority, since people who wrongfully consider it cheating post about how they don't like it and normal people just don't care. Empty vessels make the most noise.

Although I am 100% sure that rapid fire scripts are cheating, there is a slight chance that anti-recoil scripts aren't. I looked around some video game forums (including Ubisoft's ofc) and I think I know what's considered cheating. The definition of "allowed peripheral" isn't given anywhere, but here's my guess: "A single piece of hardware or any set of interconnected hardware modules that outputs a single output for each input (where time is not a factor)." which, technically, would allow anti-recoil.

There is no grey - the code of conduct makes it black and white. The code of conduct must be executed and unclear terms will be defined in favour of the defendant.

From a "legal" perspective, you are right. Yes, it's "wrong" within the parameters of the EULA, and yes it's "cheating" within those same definitions, but it's an acceptable amount of risk because the potential damage caused is negligible and the risk of being banned is close to zero.
Yes, but it's unethical.

From an ethical perspective, you can get banned for using a Xim in multiplayer competition that explicitly precludes m/kb from use to participate, but does that stop you from using a Xim for pub-stomping? Does your  Xim really make such a significant negative impact to everyone else's experience that you consider it unethical and go back to using a controller? I dare say you don't give a [email protected] what anyone else in the game thinks, as long as you're enhancing your own experience and not blatantly damaging anyone else's in the process.
So if we play with TV remotes, then people who play with controllers are cheaters?
Title: Re: is there a anti recoil thing for xim 4?
Post by: casual_gamer_ on 03:53 PM - 07/19/17
People need to understand anti-recoil for console is not the same as PC. For PC anti-recoil, it is an actual hack where it taps into the game engine and literally changing some coding to eliminate recoil. For controller it's more of a program to move your aim for you. It is actually very risky. Some games like The Division where the longer you hold the fire the higher recoil becomes. They make it worse by having some sort of continuation from when you reload.

 For example on your first mag if it takes 5 bullets before you start seeing vertical movement, on your next magazine if you continue to fire right after you reload it may only take 3 bullets before you start seeing the vertical movement, and at that point it would even be a stronger vertical movement. That's why anti-recoil script with cronusmax or Titan 1 or 2 doesn't work very well on most games.

Title: Re: is there a anti recoil thing for xim 4?
Post by: antithesis on 09:48 PM - 07/19/17
But the XIM isn't and will never be perceived as a cheating device. You are referring to a loud minority, since people who wrongfully consider it cheating post about how they don't like it and normal people just don't care. Empty vessels make the most noise.
Except it's not a vocal minority, most non-Xim users think it's a cheating device because they don't understand that we're subject to the same console gaming limitations that they are. Perception is king, despite the reality being that Xim is indeed not a cheating device.

Although I am 100% sure that rapid fire scripts are cheating, there is a slight chance that anti-recoil scripts aren't. I looked around some video game forums (including Ubisoft's ofc) and I think I know what's considered cheating. The definition of "allowed peripheral" isn't given anywhere, but here's my guess: "A single piece of hardware or any set of interconnected hardware modules that outputs a single output for each input (where time is not a factor)." which, technically, would allow anti-recoil.

There is no grey - the code of conduct makes it black and white. The code of conduct must be executed and unclear terms will be defined in favour of the defendant.
So you've just described a grey area and then said there is no grey...

What about using mod scripts as assistive technology? piiwii's already provided an example where he would be unable to play his favourite video games due to a medical condition if not able to use a rapid-fire mod.

And what about the guy I helped recently who only has half a hand and can't use a controller, nor can he comfortably use a keyboard? The best he can do is mash a group of buttons and hope to hit the right one. Using a Titan Two, he can customise his controls to meet his needs. If it weren't for the ability to modify game input, he'd be excluded from playing video games altogether.

There's an argument that preventing the use mod scripts is a form of discrimination, which likely has something to do with none of these devices being blocked or banned at the OS level.

Yes, but it's unethical.
Again, ethics are entirely subjective. What's wrong for you is right for me and I'm ok with being right.

So if we play with TV remotes, then people who play with controllers are cheaters?
Silly example, but let's go with it. If TV remotes were the default controls for consoles and some players were able to use far superior controllers instead, then yes, if you tried to use a controller in a TV remote only mode, it is most definitely cheating.

The reality is that using a Xim is not cheating, unless expressly prohibited, such as tournament rules. Given tourney rules are the highest ethical standard to benchmark oneself against, surely you find your own use of a Xim to be unethical, even while pub-stomping? Or is this another grey area...

Ethics are rubbery, terms of conduct are loose and the chances of being banned on XBL or PSN for a minor offence like using rapid-fire or anti-recoil are close as to zero as they can possibly be.

If Sony doesn't ban blatant trophy hackers, selling trophy-hacked accounts, spamming & scamming free PSN cards, or game-sharing so people don't have to pay for games (all of which is against the ToS, all of which I've reported with accompanying screenshots, and the only outcome was receiving a warning not to abuse the reporting system), then they don't give a flickety-fark about someone holding down a button to shoot.

The reason Sony cares about custom firmware is they're legally responsible to ensure software publishers are not subject to digital piracy on their platform. They try to stomp it out via firmware updates that block CFW from accessing the PSN rather than targeting individual end-users. It's very rare for even CFW users to be banned outright, unless they hack a multiplayer lobby, which directly affects the user experience of all customers of that game.

This is a pointless argument. If this is an ethical debate, they we're both right because we both have different moral perspectives. If it's a legal debate, then I am most definitely wrong, but my ethical standards permit it, so I'll do it regardless of the infinitesimal risk of getting caught.

And if do get caught, how on God's green earth do they prove it? And if they provide proof, I can either claim I have the reflexes of a snake or raise the discrimination flag...better to just ignore it because it's a very small problem that isn't worth the time or money to resolve.
Title: Re: is there a anti recoil thing for xim 4?
Post by: Supernatural X on 05:38 PM - 07/20/17
And if do get caught, how on God's green earth do they prove it? And if they provide proof, I can either claim I have the reflexes of a snake or raise the discrimination flag...better to just ignore it because it's a very small problem that isn't worth the time or money to resolve. - Antithesis

If you get banned for having anti recoil on CoD then there's no one to really raise the discrimination flag or properly defend yourself and using anti recoil is a game ruining experience thats not allowed in ToS. Also its blatantly obvious when someone is using anti recoil so it is very easy to identify. It's like saying 'because they can't prove I aimbot even though I'm blatantly aimbotting then I shouldn't be banned even though I'm ruining the gaming experience for others.

Also ethically Xim is a grey area because we are confined to controller turn speeds but have an advantage as far as shooting people but not turning around/on people.

Edit: I don't know how to quote a portion of someone's post on these forums sorry.
Title: Re: is there a anti recoil thing for xim 4?
Post by: omega4 on 01:47 PM - 07/21/17
What about using mod scripts as assistive technology? piiwii's already provided an example where he would be unable to play his favourite video games due to a medical condition if not able to use a rapid-fire mod.

And what about the guy I helped recently who only has half a hand and can't use a controller, nor can he comfortably use a keyboard? The best he can do is mash a group of buttons and hope to hit the right one. Using a Titan Two, he can customise his controls to meet his needs. If it weren't for the ability to modify game input, he'd be excluded from playing video games altogether.

There's an argument that preventing the use mod scripts is a form of discrimination, which likely has something to do with none of these devices being blocked or banned at the OS level.

You're treading on a slippery slope now. Where do you draw the line?

Do you give wallhacks to those who are close to being legally blind so they can enjoy playing a game with others?

Do you give aimbots to those who can't aim properly because of a physical handicap so they can enjoy playing game with others?

I wouldn't be opposed to offering additional aid only to those who need it if there were some way to restrict these "tools" to those who truly need it.

But we both know there's no easy way to accomplish this. And that's why I'm not in favor of creating cheats, even if it was originally intended for a good cause.
Title: Re: is there a anti recoil thing for xim 4?
Post by: S13002931 on 12:20 PM - 03/27/18
In my experience, anti-recoil is typically more trouble than its worth. All it does is automate the downward (and sometimes left or right) pull of a stick or mouse while firing to recentre your reticle on a target. It's barely worth calling a cheat, particularly considering the inconsistencies of aiming with anti-recoil active where you're largely locked into a predetermined movement pattern whether you like it or not.

Anti-recoil can do a decent enough job of controlling bullet spread, but you'll rarely fully eliminate recoil, particularly if it's randomised due to reticle bloom, or when you're tracking a moving target. Controlled burst-fire, in-game weapon mods and manual aim tends to do a better job than an anti-recoil script, whilst maintaining full reticle control throughout.

I've written probably the best Titan One anti-recoil script to use with a Xim, but I don't use it myself. I'd rather choose a weapon that feels good with a Xim and manually adapt to its recoil pattern. Knowing where to land the first shot for the last to hit the head is a lot easier than wrestling for control over the reticle when you need it most.

In the end, it really depends on the game you're playing and how comfortable you are with your load-out. Anti-recoil does help quite a bit in some games with some weapons, but it's completely useless in others.

if you record a killcam of someone using an obvious rapidifre script and you send that to sony or microsoft that person is usually banned pretty quickly
The chances of that are slim to none. Sony and MS has better things to do with their money than chase someone using a rapid-fire script. The only risk is when you're doing something a game engine is otherwise incapable of doing. This typically involves a jitter mod where a reload animation is intentionally disrupted to increase fire-rate, or spamming ADS to improve aim assist, which is frankly nauseating. Either mod is a really easy tell that you're intentionally exploiting a flaw in the game rather than automating controller input and if you do get caught doing it, it's your own stupid fault.

Not sure how old you are but you're still missing the point of what others are saying. A cheat includes aimbots, wallhacks, AND anti-recoil scripts.
Anti-recoil may be considered cheating, but aimbots and wallhacks are a completely different kettle of fish. They tap directly into the game engine to aim for you, something that's not possible on a (non-hacked) console, nor via a Titan One, Titan Two, Cronus Max or Xim Commander script.

You still have to aim properly while using anti-recoil, it just knocks some of the recoil buffeting off for you by automating a degree of X&Y axis stick movement, at the risk that you'll overshoot, undershoot or lose reticle control at a critical moment. Like rapid-fire, anti-recoil can help by focusing you more on the next shot than the last, but it can't plant a bullet in the enemy's head for you.

Whether you use mod scripts or not is entirely up to you. No-one needs to know, it doesn't dramatically affect the outcome (unless it's a blatant jitter mod) and no-one else here really has the right to judge the morality of doing it on a console m/kb forum. I write some pretty well-received Titan and CM mod scripts, more to improve my own user experience than anything, and I share them simply to provide folks with decent tools to make their own decision.


Hi. Can you please  make antirecoil script  for  xim apex   titan 1 or Cronusmax  ?   I guess   both devices  support same scripts ?  I have  Cronusmax.   

Game The Division  .   Script for Assault rifles

Thanks
Title: Re: is there a anti recoil thing for xim 4?
Post by: Od1n on 01:46 PM - 03/27/18
anti recoil scripts go a step too far and will be removed from the forum when posted
Title: Re: is there a anti recoil thing for xim 4?
Post by: antithesis on 03:48 PM - 03/27/18
Hi. Can you please  make antirecoil script  for  xim apex   titan 1 or Cronusmax  ?   I guess   both devices  support same scripts ?  I have  Cronusmax.   

Game The Division  .   Script for Assault rifles

Thanks
The Division sucks royally for anti-recoil and there are too many variables for anti-recoil to provide a predictable benefit, like duration of burst, distance to target, cover, stance, movement, weapon mods etc.

Anti-recoil is a horrible mess and falls apart the second your target moves, so no, I won't provide a script for The Division. That and this is the wrong forum to discuss or request a script. I'll say no on those forums too.

You're far better off burst-firing to control bloom in The Division. Even better, use an SMG which has virtually no recoil, especially when paired with a shield.
Title: Re: is there a anti recoil thing for xim 4?
Post by: S13002931 on 10:52 PM - 03/27/18
Hi

Very well ,   a short   YES or NO  answer will be appreciated for below  question.


Can you  " adjust  recoil" using   " ballistic curve " in xim configuration  ?


Many thanks

( I am "new" in world of xim  , I appreciate your support  and answers to questions I may ask/ asked ),   havent got time to go through 1million posts on forum.
 
 IF YOU CAN'T  GIVE  STRAIGHT ANSWER, PLEASE  DON'T  REDIRECT  ME TO THOUSAND POSTS.
 
thanks.
Title: Re: is there a anti recoil thing for xim 4?
Post by: antithesis on 11:20 PM - 03/27/18
Adjust your YX ratio above 1.0 to make recoil easier to manage, that's the best way to do it on a Xim.

Ballistics Curves are more about X-axis turn speed, though they do affect the Y axis too.
Title: Re: is there a anti recoil thing for xim 4?
Post by: S13002931 on 01:03 AM - 03/28/18
Adjust your YX ratio above 1.0 to make recoil easier to manage, that's the best way to do it on a Xim.

Ballistics Curves are more about X-axis turn speed, though they do affect the Y axis too.

Thank you  :)   hopefully I will learn all by  The Division  2 comes.   
Title: Re: is there a anti recoil thing for xim 4?
Post by: antithesis on 01:26 AM - 03/28/18
Thank you  :)   hopefully I will learn all by  The Division  2 comes.
No worries. Hopefully The Division 2 doesn't have such poor look mechanics on console.
Title: Re: is there a anti recoil thing for xim 4?
Post by: Nataliy on 02:39 AM - 03/28/18
We embarked on this path to play better, we are not pirates, there is a сronus max and I have it, but I do not use it, I use the Bloody mouse to repay the recoil, for each weapon individually, thanks: - *
Title: Re: is there a anti recoil thing for xim 4?
Post by: S13002931 on 05:09 AM - 03/28/18
We embarked on this path to play better, we are not pirates, there is a сronus max and I have it, but I do not use it, I use the Bloody mouse to repay the recoil, for each weapon individually, thanks: - *

I have cronusmax & I use it  :)  (  also bought licence ($5) from consoletunner to use their  software on CM ....)     but   if you play The Division  and have recoil settings for  Tom Clancy's The Division  , can you please assist me ?   I want  use Assault rifles, M4 with striker  cheese.

Smgs are for noobs.  Waiting for Support of Xim apex on cronusmax, probably will have  cheesy  scripts  on CM forum.   I dont mind consoletunner either. Like I said I can register CM dongle on Titan 1 too.   Cash isn't problem here.