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General Category => General Discussion => Topic started by: swendle on 12:12 PM - 06/13/16

Title: New Xbox for 2017! What does this mean for XIM4?
Post by: swendle on 12:12 PM - 06/13/16
Are there plans to make a XIM5 for the next gen consoles?
Title: Re: New Xbox for 2017! What does this mean for XIM4?
Post by: OBsIV on 12:13 PM - 06/13/16
Well, of course. :) But, it sounds like all games will be forward and backward compatible -- including accessories. So, it all should just work. Really good move by Microsoft.
Title: Re: New Xbox for 2017! What does this mean for XIM4?
Post by: swendle on 12:40 PM - 06/13/16
Yes! That is really good to hear!
Title: Re: New Xbox for 2017! What does this mean for XIM4?
Post by: mikael on 01:38 PM - 06/13/16
What??? Already a new gen console? What is that about?
Title: New Xbox for 2017! What does this mean for XIM4?
Post by: kayoussoldier on 01:46 PM - 06/13/16
Isn't it just a slim xbox one that supports 4k video output (not games, just video) and has bigger HDD options or did I miss something. Hardware performance is supposed to be the same.

It's not the start of a new generation.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Title: Re: New Xbox for 2017! What does this mean for XIM4?
Post by: Phil Ashio on 01:50 PM - 06/13/16
The slim which is mostly the same except with 4k video playback is coming out soon. Xbox One codename Scorpio is a 6 teraflop version coming out holiday season 2017.
Title: Re: New Xbox for 2017! What does this mean for XIM4?
Post by: kayoussoldier on 01:52 PM - 06/13/16
Ok gotcha. That's pretty quick for a new console cycle.


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Title: Re: New Xbox for 2017! What does this mean for XIM4?
Post by: mist4fun on 10:36 PM - 06/13/16
Four years again, just like Xbox to Xbox 360.
Title: Re: New Xbox for 2017! What does this mean for XIM4?
Post by: xRickyTick on 04:10 AM - 06/14/16
Yea but how long from 360 to the One? Seems like a decade. Very unexpected, but I'm sure I'll have to buy one  :-\
Title: Re: New Xbox for 2017! What does this mean for XIM4?
Post by: Manjerico on 04:12 AM - 06/14/16
I think this four year cycle was to be expected and also I doesn't render the previous generation obsolete. When this generation came out the two main focus points where the lack of power and the similarities to PC's, so it's not that surprising that there would be two types of consoles on the same generation, just like you have more and less powerful builds in PC gaming.

What I'm more interested to see is the whole "Play anywhere" gimmick. It sounds really good, a little to good to be true... I think it will be only for a handful of titles, but I hope to be wrong.
Title: Re: New Xbox for 2017! What does this mean for XIM4?
Post by: Od1n on 09:21 AM - 06/14/16
cannot wait to hear more about the console, maybe around gamescom in august? :)
a new halo on that console could be HUGE, maybe as a launch title?!

since microsoft is targeting a compatiblitly between the current xbox and the new one which should also include the controllers the xim should work right out of the box
obviously speculation so lets wait for more concrete infos :)
Title: Re: New Xbox for 2017! What does this mean for XIM4?
Post by: RML on 11:27 AM - 06/14/16
cannot wait to hear more about the console, maybe around gamescom in august? :)
a new halo on that console could be HUGE, maybe as a launch title?!

since microsoft is targeting a compatiblitly between the current xbox and the new one which should also include the controllers the xim should work right out of the box
obviously speculation so lets wait for more concrete infos :)

I'm sure I'll have one DAY ONE, of course the first thing I will do is test XIM4 on it.  ;)
Title: Re: New Xbox for 2017! What does this mean for XIM4?
Post by: britlad on 12:18 PM - 06/14/16
i'll be on the scorpio model quicker than a whore on payday can't wait also hopefully they;ll be a xim5 not that there anything wrong with the current model  which thanks to the ximn4 i can't actually play on console
Title: Re: New Xbox for 2017! What does this mean for XIM4?
Post by: Zen on 04:16 AM - 06/15/16
Quote
Still running a 1080p TV? Then you should forget about buying Xbox Scorpio.
That’s the message from Xbox boss Phil Spencer. He was asked by Eurogamer about the thinking behind announcing the new Xbox One S only to an hour later reveal a brand new machine, Xbox Scorpio.
“You should buy [the Xbox One S], because Scorpio is not going to do anything for you,” Spencer said after asking the reviewer what TV he had – in this instance a 1080p set. “Scorpio is designed as a 4K console, and if you don't have a 4K TV, the benefit we've designed for, you're not going to see.
“Clearly, you can buy Scorpio, and if and when you decide you want to buy a 4K television to take advantage of the increased performance, obviously the console will be ready for you. For us in the industry, it's easy to think that most power is always the thing that wins. If you look at last gen, what won? The Wii won. The Wii sold more than we did on Xbox 360 and the PS3, and it wasn't the most powerful console out there. Price is critically important. Wii was a good price and it had a great experience.
“Scorpio is for the person who's got a 4K television, who's really focused on 4K gaming. It's going to be a premium price over what we're selling this one for, and both of them will exist in the market at the same time. Scorpio is for your 4K gamer. And that's what we designed it for.”
It was speculated yesterday that while it seems Xbox Scorpio will have a quite significant power advantage over PS4 Neo, that advantage will come at a cost – that literally being the cost, which could be some $100 more than Sony’s new machine.

Title: Re: New Xbox for 2017! What does this mean for XIM4?
Post by: Phil Ashio on 05:01 AM - 06/15/16
That's really dumb messaging. For the first time in years hardcore gamers are looking at an Xbox again, getting excited for the prospect of playing games at true 1080p60 or maybe higher and with advanced graphics and he's putting a pin to that balloon. If it's going to be a mandate that devs must use the extra capability for 4k or VR, basically crapping all that power away, instead of using it how they please then @#$% it. What's the point?

Oh, BTW. The Gears of War 4 devs are saying Xbox One S (not scorpio) will actually be SLIGHTLY more powerful and they'll use that power to clean up some of the rough spots performance wise during the campaign. However, again, Phil Spencer says that's not what Xbox S was designed to do and not to get too excited.
Title: Re: New Xbox for 2017! What does this mean for XIM4?
Post by: royoverinnan on 05:09 AM - 06/15/16
Agree. If the only upside is higher resolution and graphics, but still only 30-45 frames, this is @#$%.
If the consoles are getting that much power, they should also implement the ability to chosse resolution, and the frames would be a consequence of the choosen resolution (low res = high frames, hig res = lower frames)
Title: Re: New Xbox for 2017! What does this mean for XIM4?
Post by: Zen on 06:16 AM - 06/15/16
Agree
Title: Re: New Xbox for 2017! What does this mean for XIM4?
Post by: Manjerico on 08:41 AM - 06/15/16
Agree. If the only upside is higher resolution and graphics, but still only 30-45 frames, this is @#$%.
If the consoles are getting that much power, they should also implement the ability to chosse resolution, and the frames would be a consequence of the choosen resolution (low res = high frames, hig res = lower frames)

Exactly, just like PC games. I don't this would be that hard to implement on consoles.
Title: Re: New Xbox for 2017! What does this mean for XIM4?
Post by: Od1n on 09:01 AM - 06/15/16
while he might think that way now im sure the PS4 Neo wont follow that way since 4,5 Tflop just arent enough for 4K (let alone the jaguar CPU)
means the PS4 Neo will probably use that additional GPU power for better GFX - and as soon as they do that Xbox will follow to be on par with them or even go for better GFX

therefore i wouldnt take his words for gold now
Title: Re: New Xbox for 2017! What does this mean for XIM4?
Post by: RML on 07:14 PM - 06/15/16
It simply means, Lot of Fun to be had down the Road!  :)
Title: Re: New Xbox for 2017! What does this mean for XIM4?
Post by: antithesis on 08:12 PM - 06/15/16
Quote
Still running a 1080p TV? Then you should forget about buying Xbox Scorpio.
That’s the message from Xbox boss Phil Spencer. He was asked by Eurogamer about the thinking behind announcing the new Xbox One S only to an hour later reveal a brand new machine, Xbox Scorpio.
“You should buy [the Xbox One S], because Scorpio is not going to do anything for you,” Spencer said after asking the reviewer what TV he had – in this instance a 1080p set. “Scorpio is designed as a 4K console, and if you don't have a 4K TV, the benefit we've designed for, you're not going to see.
“Clearly, you can buy Scorpio, and if and when you decide you want to buy a 4K television to take advantage of the increased performance, obviously the console will be ready for you. For us in the industry, it's easy to think that most power is always the thing that wins. If you look at last gen, what won? The Wii won. The Wii sold more than we did on Xbox 360 and the PS3, and it wasn't the most powerful console out there. Price is critically important. Wii was a good price and it had a great experience.
“Scorpio is for the person who's got a 4K television, who's really focused on 4K gaming. It's going to be a premium price over what we're selling this one for, and both of them will exist in the market at the same time. Scorpio is for your 4K gamer. And that's what we designed it for.”
It was speculated yesterday that while it seems Xbox Scorpio will have a quite significant power advantage over PS4 Neo, that advantage will come at a cost – that literally being the cost, which could be some $100 more than Sony’s new machine.

Once again proving that Xbox is headed by complete fcuktards. 4K TV to get the benefits of a Scorpio? You've just kissed the majority of your potential userbase goodbye. I'm sure it'll support 1080p, but the messaging is all wrong.

Expect another backdown, along the lines of #dealwithit. I'm not buying a 4K TV just to play games on one console. 4K video is too large and bandwidth-intensive, so I see no other benefits to dropping the cash.

Now, if he'd said "solid 1080p @ 60FPS", "Rift" and/or "Vive" rather than the anticipated "4K @ 20-30FPS", I'd be all over this like a fat kid on a Twinkie. But yet again, MS has managed to completely diminish any interest I had in their new console by alienating their own customers.

Thanks, but no thanks, I'll stick with Sony.

Agree. If the only upside is higher resolution and graphics, but still only 30-45 frames, this is @#$%.
If the consoles are getting that much power, they should also implement the ability to chosse resolution, and the frames would be a consequence of the choosen resolution (low res = high frames, hig res = lower frames)

That's exactly what I was expecting from Neo and Scorpio, alongside VR support. More or less Ultra settings versions of 1080p console games, instead of the crippleware we usually get to ensure consistent framerates.

The game is the same experience on both iterations of the PS4 and XB1, but the graphics and/or FPS are pimped on the newer versions. That's enough for them to take my money.
Title: Re: New Xbox for 2017! What does this mean for XIM4?
Post by: Zen on 02:20 AM - 06/16/16
Surely though if you got a game like cod for instance with a target fps of 60 on the new console you won't get those dips and it will get the game right on that 60. Not sure I'd buy a new console just for that but if they dips were say really bad on bf1 and the new console kept that target 60 I'd probably be in
Title: Re: New Xbox for 2017! What does this mean for XIM4?
Post by: antithesis on 07:48 AM - 06/16/16
Flop in-bound - http://www.gamespot.com/articles/some-xbox-one-games-might-run-better-on-project-sc/1100-6440959/

Quote
Despite the better performance of some existing games, Spencer says you shouldn't "buy Scorpio to run your existing library of games."

Seriously, why is MS targeting 4K gaming? It's too early to be adopted as the standard, particularly for consoles, when the GTX 1080 still fails to hit 60FPS, even in SLi mode, for many current games in bleeding-edge gaming rigs. Oftentimes it struggles to hit 30FPS.

"Some games will run better on Scorpio." Some games... Who's next in line as the head of Xbox? Phil better start preparing his resume. All XB1 games should run 1080p @ 60 FPS on Scorpio, if it truly has 6 whopperflops under the hood.

The other issue MS is facing by attempting to launch what seems to be a new gen this early (http://www.gamespot.com/articles/some-games-could-be-exclusive-to-new-xbox-scorpio-/1100-6440815) is if Scorpio can't run XB1 games better than the Neo can run PS4 games, they've already lost. You can't bank on exclusives alone to win a console war. Cross-platform gaming needs to be better on the Scorpio, or there's no point even trying.

MS has seriously underestimated the intelligence of gamers on this one. They made that mistake in 2013 and they're still paying for it. Bad marketing. Very bad. Sit in the corner and think about what you've done.

If MS can snag Rift and / or Vive compatibility, that'll sell me on Scorpio for sure as it'll mean I don't need to fork out a few grand to replace my 2009 gaming PC. I want to save money, not spend more. Why not target VR and go head-to-head with Sony instead of BS 4K gaming?

Hyperbole aside, I'll still get a Scorpio (XB1 S isn't even a blip on the radar), but will continue to buy cross-platform games (i.e 90+% of them) on PlayStation.
Title: Re: New Xbox for 2017! What does this mean for XIM4?
Post by: RML on 10:19 AM - 06/16/16
I agree 60 fps should be the #1 goal. Can they pull off 4k @ 60 fps? I doubt it, that's what they're saying they will deliver though.
Title: Re: New Xbox for 2017! What does this mean for XIM4?
Post by: gloryandi on 01:30 PM - 06/16/16
I think something like Scorpio is designed as a niche product.  Like the latest graphics cards.  A small number of people want a console that can output 4K and those same people probably invest in things like VR which could use the additional horsepower.

What was most interesting is that little was said about VR when Scropio was announced and it seemed entirely focused on 4K.



Title: Re: New Xbox for 2017! What does this mean for XIM4?
Post by: Phil Ashio on 02:37 PM - 06/16/16
Odin is right. He's already flip flopping. Saying even some existing games, like those with res scaling, will benefit and that devs can choose what they want to do with that 6 teraflops even though they're marketing it as a 4k system. There's more than a year and a half to go so obviously they have plenty of time to hear feedback and act on it.

That's Microsoft's big problem. Since Jay Allard left they don't seem to know how to listen to what gamers want. I haven't heard a single person go, "4k! Yay!" I think everyone hoped and assumed that these consoles would be Ultra 1080p60 systems. I'll add to that that I wish they'd focus on decreasing input lag as well which is oddly more than last gen.
Title: Re: New Xbox for 2017! What does this mean for XIM4?
Post by: antithesis on 04:27 PM - 06/16/16
I think something like Scorpio is designed as a niche product.  Like the latest graphics cards.  A small number of people want a console that can output 4K and those same people probably invest in things like VR which could use the additional horsepower.

What was most interesting is that little was said about VR when Scropio was announced and it seemed entirely focused on 4K.

Bottom line - MS cannot afford to launch a niche console, no-one can. 4K is niche and MS is trying to push something mainstream that we don't either don't want or don't need. They tried pushing us with the XB1 instead of asking us what we wanted. It didn't work and they lost significant marketshare thanks to their hubris.

This comes at a time when MS has only just clawed back the lost goodwill by implementing a solid catalogue of backwards-compatible 360 games. Sony did the same thing at PS4 launch via PS Now, but few people want a rental service to pay for games they already own and it's become an expensive liability. MS won that battle big time and should have come out swinging by singing our tune, not their own.

The message is simple - ultra settings for 1080p @ 60 FPS. That's what Sony's aiming for with the Neo, MS should have followed suit. The biggest complaint about the XB1 is it can't do 1080p and 60FPS at the same time...open your friggin ears MS!

Anybody want 4K @ 30 FPS? Nope. We'll get upscaled 1440p instead. That still sounds pretty good, but it's not what we're paying for and a real concern for the many of us still using 1080p HDTVs.

Xbox has become so enamoured with themselves over the success of the overpriced Elite Controller that they assume we're going to gobble up a 4K console with a $1K price tag...ain't gonna happen.

Phil's going to do a backflip that'll make Olympic gymnasts applaud in awe. Always online. Kinect required. No game trades. #dealwithit.
Title: Re: New Xbox for 2017! What does this mean for XIM4?
Post by: RML on 07:06 PM - 06/16/16
Do we know for sure that there won't be options with Scorpio? 4k, lower frame rate, 1080p higher frame rate, etc.
Title: Re: New Xbox for 2017! What does this mean for XIM4?
Post by: antithesis on 08:53 PM - 06/16/16
Do we know for sure that there won't be options with Scorpio? 4k, lower frame rate, 1080p higher frame rate, etc.

No we don't. My expectation will be that 1080p @ 60FPS will be the standard for new XB1 games. You can't quadruple terafloppage and not improve gaming performance for all current and future games.

Where MS is being careful with their messaging is to avoid saying "all games @ 1080p/60FPS", because many current XB1 games are only 900p and/or 30FPS. They are obviously not going to improve resolution, with the exception of those featuring dynamic resolution, but the framerates have to improve...unless, of course, they're capped.

Doubtless, the Scorpio, if it proves to have the power MS is touting (it's speculation at this point - the GPU is capable of 6TF, but MS hasn't said the console is), it'll be a significant upgrade to the XB1 and should compete with or exceed the PS4 and Neo in terms of graphics fidelity, resolution and framerate. But MS is choosing not to emphasise that, instead focusing on 4K, which few of us actually care about. Expect that to change when Sony announce the Neo system specs.
Title: Re: New Xbox for 2017! What does this mean for XIM4?
Post by: RML on 09:08 PM - 06/16/16
Actually they said that the developers asked for 6 tflops and that's why it became the target goal. I personally look forward to 4k, will it be something I use for multiplayer or VR? Probably not, but it would be nice for RPG's.

For me, their biggest problem right now is games. Sony is winning from that standpoint and I say that even though I'm a big GOW fan. That's Gears of War for you Sony guys. :P
Title: Re: New Xbox for 2017! What does this mean for XIM4?
Post by: piiwii on 11:36 PM - 06/16/16
This is my fear: we all know that it doesn't have the horsepower to do 4k at 60fps. So what are most devs going to do with that extra horse power? Make 1080p games at 120fps.

This will destroy me. I already find it hard to go from 60fps to 30fps, if my eyes get used to 120fps this will ruin a lot of games for me and I can't do that to myself. I need to remain ignorant. Until 120fps games are the standard, I will ignore any game that targets this. I cannot get used to something so good. No, no, no.
Title: Re: New Xbox for 2017! What does this mean for XIM4?
Post by: antithesis on 12:01 AM - 06/17/16
This is my fear: we all know that it doesn't have the horsepower to do 4k at 60fps. So what are most devs going to do with that extra horse power? Make 1080p games at 120fps.

The console market is still firmly in the lounge room. Most TVs function at 60Hz, ergo, 60FPS. 120FPS won't make a lick of sh!t difference for the majority of HDTVs, other than to render them useless.

The extra horsepower should be used for solid 60FPS and ultra graphics settings.
Title: Re: New Xbox for 2017! What does this mean for XIM4?
Post by: royoverinnan on 12:27 AM - 06/17/16
This is my fear: we all know that it doesn't have the horsepower to do 4k at 60fps. So what are most devs going to do with that extra horse power? Make 1080p games at 120fps.

This will destroy me. I already find it hard to go from 60fps to 30fps, if my eyes get used to 120fps this will ruin a lot of games for me and I can't do that to myself. I need to remain ignorant. Until 120fps games are the standard, I will ignore any game that targets this. I cannot get used to something so good. No, no, no.


yeah, when you are used to something better, it is hard to go back. 6 months ago I upgraded the PC to GTX 980 card and a G-sync screen. Playing on the PS4 now hurts my eyes.

Display Port and G-sync / Freesync should also be included in the PS4 / Xbox (my opinion). That would be great.
Title: Re: New Xbox for 2017! What does this mean for XIM4?
Post by: Phil Ashio on 01:01 AM - 06/17/16
This is my fear: we all know that it doesn't have the horsepower to do 4k at 60fps. So what are most devs going to do with that extra horse power? Make 1080p games at 120fps.

This will destroy me. I already find it hard to go from 60fps to 30fps, if my eyes get used to 120fps this will ruin a lot of games for me and I can't do that to myself. I need to remain ignorant. Until 120fps games are the standard, I will ignore any game that targets this. I cannot get used to something so good. No, no, no.

Scorpio could do 4k at 60fps it's just the game won't look good. That's the thing, do devs go for more pixels or prettier pixels. Because you can't have both without increasing the rendering time.  If they go for purely more, then truly the majority of people with 1080p TVs won't benefit. It really wouldn't be worth it for 4k users either because all their getting is similar quality graphics except with the crispness that's more fitting a big @#$% screen.
Title: Re: New Xbox for 2017! What does this mean for XIM4?
Post by: piiwii on 01:47 AM - 06/17/16


yeah, when you are used to something better, it is hard to go back. 6 months ago I upgraded the PC to GTX 980 card and a G-sync screen. Playing on the PS4 now hurts my eyes.


Yup that's exactly it. I don't want 120fps to be the standard until most games can support it. If it's just the occasional game then it'll ruin it for all the other games I play.
Title: Re: New Xbox for 2017! What does this mean for XIM4?
Post by: piiwii on 02:24 AM - 06/17/16
This is my fear: we all know that it doesn't have the horsepower to do 4k at 60fps. So what are most devs going to do with that extra horse power? Make 1080p games at 120fps.

The console market is still firmly in the lounge room. Most TVs function at 60Hz, ergo, 60FPS. 120FPS won't make a lick of sh!t difference for the majority of HDTVs, other than to render them useless.

The extra horsepower should be used for solid 60FPS and ultra graphics settings.

Oh for some reason I assumed 4K tv's were 120Hz? (Or at least targeting 120Hz in the medium term, like how most first gen HD TV's were 1080i instead of 1080p)
Title: Re: New Xbox for 2017! What does this mean for XIM4?
Post by: CameronMC on 07:23 AM - 06/17/16
15 JUN 2016
E3 2016: XBOX ONE IS 'MONTHS AWAY' FROM MOUSE AND KEYBOARD SUPPORT
Title: Re: New Xbox for 2017! What does this mean for XIM4?
Post by: gloryandi on 08:00 AM - 06/17/16
This is my fear: we all know that it doesn't have the horsepower to do 4k at 60fps. So what are most devs going to do with that extra horse power? Make 1080p games at 120fps.

This will destroy me. I already find it hard to go from 60fps to 30fps, if my eyes get used to 120fps this will ruin a lot of games for me and I can't do that to myself. I need to remain ignorant. Until 120fps games are the standard, I will ignore any game that targets this. I cannot get used to something so good. No, no, no.

I know you're joking a bit, but I am totally with you.  I play mostly console so my monitor is 60 Hz.  I did this intentionally so I wouldn't play at 120 on my PC and get used the better experience.
Title: Re: New Xbox for 2017! What does this mean for XIM4?
Post by: piiwii on 08:13 AM - 06/17/16
This is my fear: we all know that it doesn't have the horsepower to do 4k at 60fps. So what are most devs going to do with that extra horse power? Make 1080p games at 120fps.

This will destroy me. I already find it hard to go from 60fps to 30fps, if my eyes get used to 120fps this will ruin a lot of games for me and I can't do that to myself. I need to remain ignorant. Until 120fps games are the standard, I will ignore any game that targets this. I cannot get used to something so good. No, no, no.

I know you're joking a bit, but I am totally with you.  I play mostly console so my monitor is 60 Hz.  I did this intentionally so I wouldn't play at 120 on my PC and get used the better experience.

No it's no joke. I can't enjoy 30fps games anymore and it cuts me off a lot of great games. If I got used to 120fps and they only constitute like 10% of the market then I'm screwed.
Title: Re: New Xbox for 2017! What does this mean for XIM4?
Post by: Bully on 02:37 AM - 06/19/16
Official video - http://www.xbox.com/en-US/project-scorpio
Title: Re: New Xbox for 2017! What does this mean for XIM4?
Post by: divisionbell77 on 02:20 PM - 06/20/16
Yea but how long from 360 to the One? Seems like a decade. Very unexpected, but I'm sure I'll have to buy one  :-\

MS stated this was happening a bit ago.  Now that they are on Windows for the XBOX OS, and sticking with it as the OS, MS has turned the XBOX into something you can upgrade sooner, or later, depending on if you want prettier graphics, performance, and new features.

I personally do not care about 4K, but would love to be able to have 1080P 144FPS to match my monitor for smoother game play.  Or the ability to turn on AA in games like BF4, that look horrible on the XB1.