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Kotaku: The Fight Over How To Play Ovewatch On Consoles  (Read 13025 times)

Offline AKs0n-

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Offline willthetech

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Re: Kotaku: The Fight Over How To Play Ovewatch On Consoles
« Reply #16 on: 02:27 AM - 02/11/17 »
best sentence in the whole article:

"XIM isnít about an advantage, but, for the many people out there like myself who cannot game well using a thumbstick, itís about not having a disadvantage."

This should be at the front page of your site.

"XIM isnít about an advantage, itís about not having a disadvantage." 8)

Offline AKs0n-

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Re: Kotaku: The Fight Over How To Play Ovewatch On Consoles
« Reply #17 on: 02:49 AM - 02/11/17 »
best sentence in the whole article:

"XIM isnít about an advantage, but, for the many people out there like myself who cannot game well using a thumbstick, itís about not having a disadvantage."

This should be at the front page of your site.

"XIM isnít about an advantage, itís about not having a disadvantage." 8)
Yeah seriously... this man is a gd brilliant speaker. Genius. Everything he said is undeniable truth. Great story behind everything as well.

Offline AIIIIDS!

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Re: Kotaku: The Fight Over How To Play Ovewatch On Consoles
« Reply #18 on: 06:33 PM - 02/11/17 »
For me it's about comfort. I have been a PC gamer all my life, I'm comfortable with a mouse, gamepads give me cramps and are simply not ideal for my go-to genre - shooters.

Really it's about using the right tool for the job. I wouldn't squat in running shoes or jog in weightlifting shoes, and I wouldn't play a shooter with sticks or a fighting game with a keyboard when an arcade stick is preferable and doesn't negatively affect my performance.

As for the so called 'even playing field', fact is there is no such thing. The closest you're gonna get is organized tournaments with uniform hardware, but even those aren't completely even, since there are differences even among the experienced players who participate in those.

Look at sports, top athletes pretty much all train the same, they all train hard, but not everyone is a gold medalist, a top scoring footballer, or Michael Jordan.

Even among controller users no one is equal. You have the casuals, and the MLG tryhards who are better at aiming with thumbsticks, and are probably using some mod for their controllers to improve their performance.

I would advise the people crying about their poor performance and blaming it on M+K players to focus on self improvement instead of looking for scapegoats.

I'm sure if you gave them all adapters they'd still play poorly and then blame it on something else.

As for citing previous tests done by matching mouse and keyboard players against controller players, I don't think those are relevant, simply because M+K on PC is unrestricted, whereas on consoles with an adapter you are still subject to the same aiming scheme and hardcoded limits as everyone else.

I can understand how someone can watch videos and come to the conclusion that using XIM4 instantly turns you into the John Wick of video games, since those feature  experienced M+K users playing against casuals with controllers, but I see plenty of good pad users who are serious about gaming, and aim well, do the same to other pad users.

A proper test, IMO, would be XIM4 users against competitive console gamers. Set that up, record it and upload it.


Offline xSundown

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Re: Kotaku: The Fight Over How To Play Ovewatch On Consoles
« Reply #19 on: 06:04 AM - 02/17/17 »
My eyes hurt after reading that yellow text lol. Great answers. Nobody says anything about racing wheels for racing games. Yet everyone loses their minds for a mouse for aiming... I love it.
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Offline buckshot50

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Re: Kotaku: The Fight Over How To Play Ovewatch On Consoles
« Reply #20 on: 11:06 PM - 02/20/17 »
I'm a little let down you didn't post the joker meme with that :)
Totally true btw!

Offline SaltySkyKnight

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Re: Kotaku: The Fight Over How To Play Ovewatch On Consoles
« Reply #21 on: 10:24 PM - 03/05/17 »
For me it's about comfort. I have been a PC gamer all my life, I'm comfortable with a mouse, gamepads give me cramps and are simply not ideal for my go-to genre - shooters.

Really it's about using the right tool for the job. I wouldn't squat in running shoes or jog in weightlifting shoes, and I wouldn't play a shooter with sticks or a fighting game with a keyboard when an arcade stick is preferable and doesn't negatively affect my performance.

As for the so called 'even playing field', fact is there is no such thing. The closest you're gonna get is organized tournaments with uniform hardware, but even those aren't completely even, since there are differences even among the experienced players who participate in those.

Look at sports, top athletes pretty much all train the same, they all train hard, but not everyone is a gold medalist, a top scoring footballer, or Michael Jordan.

Even among controller users no one is equal. You have the casuals, and the MLG tryhards who are better at aiming with thumbsticks, and are probably using some mod for their controllers to improve their performance.

I would advise the people crying about their poor performance and blaming it on M+K players to focus on self improvement instead of looking for scapegoats.

I'm sure if you gave them all adapters they'd still play poorly and then blame it on something else.

As for citing previous tests done by matching mouse and keyboard players against controller players, I don't think those are relevant, simply because M+K on PC is unrestricted, whereas on consoles with an adapter you are still subject to the same aiming scheme and hardcoded limits as everyone else.

I can understand how someone can watch videos and come to the conclusion that using XIM4 instantly turns you into the John Wick of video games, since those feature  experienced M+K users playing against casuals with controllers, but I see plenty of good pad users who are serious about gaming, and aim well, do the same to other pad users.

A proper test, IMO, would be XIM4 users against competitive console gamers. Set that up, record it and upload it.

A Xim is however an obvious advantage in everyway and needs to be noted as one not denied.

I was a competitive controller player for years, have never picked up a Mouse once in my life aside from typing, bought a Xim and in under 5 hours was pulling the same and then higher k/DS than I was previously, getting kills at ranges I never would have attempted with controller among countless other small noticable changes, I have under 70 hours of MnK gameplay and I can confidently say that it feels far superior to my thousands of hours of controller muscle memory, as MnK is far easier to just pick up and use than a controller, it's basic principle.  My k/d didn't increase too much per se but oh my kpm was significantly higher, the mouse lets me play more aggressive raising my average kpm from a 2.5 to around 3.5-4 on Battlefield, I played Ow for the first time ever after getting my Xim and Im already ranked globally on leaderboards for it (I would be with controller too but likely not as good)

Its astonishgly scary that most MnK players are still using aim assist too (something I never used as a controller player) so not only are you basically cheating with a Xim you are also letting the game aim with your superior input device lmao.

For me using MnK is a moral gray area, I have millions of MnK-Hackusations on multiple games from when I used a controller lol I actually bought a Xim as a bucket list type thing, I bought it to piss people off because I was accussed of it for so long and holy @#$% I will never pick up a controller again because a MnK is just that, superior, to a controller in everyway.

However an interesting thing to note, in all my experiences with competitive gaming, controller players were actually always the best players, ironically enough with a few MnK players who competed at the same level (tho significantly less ratio wise), I always figured it was due to the fact most people buy MnK and expect to be gods instantly(like me lol), and they were bad PC players who came to console to dominate on console plebs but couldn't compete competitively, but the truth of the matter is while MnK is an advantage, it's about the intelligence of the player themselves and how much of the MnK advantage they can use.  I can pickup any FPS game and dominate (and that's not some Dunning-Kruger assumption mind you) with controller or MnK, although MnK is undoubtedly superior, almost the same things can be done with controller, MnK is just far better for muscle memory and will allow bad players to cheese some dumb kills at times, as MnK can do things a controller never will but its still not like PC.

This is why it's a gray area for me, I kinda wish console would get native MnK support on all games cuz it's just better, tho I wish console would also be controller only as it's meant to be, controller just feels so bad compared to MnK. Sony and Microsoft need to just provide and mandate native support honestly, while it is cheating to use a Xim I don't really care, I hardly play games now anyway and I was accussed of it for so long it feels good to have one.  Its an advantage but only a minor one for a good player, as when I had controller I still beat MnK players daily, it's just even easier now, I feel like MnK is a larger advantage for worse players especially with aim assist added to that, tho they still wont be able to compete at a high level competitive level unless they already did with a controller.

Overall I just contradicted myself there a multitude of times in my rant,
TL;DR MnK is a major advantage but I can't go back to controller it's just superior, console needs native MnK.

Offline piiwii

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Re: Kotaku: The Fight Over How To Play Ovewatch On Consoles
« Reply #22 on: 10:51 PM - 03/05/17 »
console needs native MnK.

I've said this before and I'll say it again - even if 100% of developers supported native M&K on console, XIM would still have an important role to play.

Developers always do stupid crap like aim acceleration, velocity jumps and the like.

I'm playing Horizon right now and it has this thing where the camera speed increases if you're sprinting, and drops when you're using this investigation mode. Destiny is the opposite -  you turn slower when you sprint.

I've even seem bad aim acceleration on PC.

Devs just have this addiction to solving problems that don't actually exist.
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Offline SANTERO

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Re: Kotaku: The Fight Over How To Play Ovewatch On Consoles
« Reply #23 on: 05:30 AM - 03/14/17 »
wow this is beautiful

Offline Descendits

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Re: Kotaku: The Fight Over How To Play Ovewatch On Consoles
« Reply #24 on: 12:25 PM - 03/16/17 »
I'm not going to lie, myself and probably a good 90% of other XIM users purchased the XIM with the intention of exploiting mouse and keyboard capabilities. Only to be somewhat disappointed in the 'limited' console input that you mention... Though, it was almost a relief, and honestly I just loved the excitement of having a different way to play the same games. It feels weird to pick up my controller and play some other games now. As I only use XIM for FPS which I primarily play. But there is a kind of community within XIM and it is kind of a hobby... making your own personalized settings and customizing your game play. It's just more fun! Precision aiming can be easier for me, but it certainly is nothing that will inflate my skill as the dynamics of being a talented gamer transcend into many more factors than simply aiming.

PS tbh I feel that an anologue stick and scuff provide much better movement than a mouse and keyboard. Having unlimited vectors of movement and having the ability to move at a different speed as opposed to a keyboard button on/off is better. The only advantage offered is the precision of a mouse which, as you mention, is limited to the capacity of a controllers input.

Offline shawly

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Re: Kotaku: The Fight Over How To Play Ovewatch On Consoles
« Reply #25 on: 04:27 AM - 03/29/17 »
A somewhat good solution would be, that both M$ and $ony should support KB/M and the ability for game developers to check which input devices are used and separate players into different lobbies.
Then the XIM could identify as official controller or official KB/M, depending on what type of input device you connect to the XIM.
This way XIM players with unsupported controllers still get into controller lobbies and KB/M users get to play with other KB/M users.

This way controller players couldn't complain about the unfairness anymore, KB/M users can still play with KB/M and people with certain disabilities can still use their special devices without being excluded.

The only problem that needs to be solved is how a party of different players get treated, I couldn't come up with a good solution, but the one solution is, either everyone uses a controller or no one uses a controller, or the friends with controllers agree to going into KB/M lobbies.
But this way the XIM won't lose it's purpose and everyone is happy, except for the people that use the XIM intentionally to get an advantage over controller players.

P.S.: Sorry if someone already came up with this, I didn't read all the posts.
« Last Edit: 05:06 AM - 03/29/17 by shawly »

Offline omega4

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Re: Kotaku: The Fight Over How To Play Ovewatch On Consoles
« Reply #26 on: 08:37 PM - 04/01/17 »
Hi everyone. First time poster here but I did buy an XIM4 and have been using it for several months now, so I wanted to share my perspective.

I'm not handicapped (at least not physically although some might argue mentally). I can use controllers without any pain or discomfort.

Yet I bought an XIM4 to gain an advantage over my fellow console (PS4, XBox One) gamers. And to that end, the XIM4 was money well-spent as it's performed flawlessly.

Prior to getting an XIM4, my KDR in COD Infinite Warfare was around 0.80 - 0.90 in Team Deathmatch. Sad but true.

After getting an XIM4, my KDR is now around 2.0 - 3.0 in TDM. It's lower now because I'm trying to get gold camos for the SMGs and that "slide kill" thing is wreaking havoc on my KDR.

I'm not going to make any excuses. My testimonial is simply if you want to dominate other console gamers who are still using controllers, you owe it to yourself to buy an XIM4.
My XIM4 allows me to play against other gamers like....


Offline mazeeree

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Kotaku: The Fight Over How To Play Ovewatch On Consoles
« Reply #27 on: 06:59 PM - 04/14/17 »
It is and always will be an advantage, especially in competitive / eSports games.

For example, I'm playing among the top 5 ESL teams in Rainbow Six and since I got the XIM, I was able to maintain my KD at 2.0 @ lvl 223, being diamond and carrying teams to victory since year 1 season 2.

Sure, game sense plays a huge role in how you utilize the aim advantage but let's be honest, my stats wouldn't be as good and some important ESL games would've been lost if I had played with a controller that day.

As already said, it's indeed a moral gray area. It's up to you how you deal with it but please stop finding excuses and try to convince people it is anything but an advantage, because is it and always will be in any game. 


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Offline OBsIV

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Re: Kotaku: The Fight Over How To Play Ovewatch On Consoles
« Reply #28 on: 07:45 PM - 04/14/17 »
It is and always will be an advantage, especially in competitive / eSports games.

To say it's an advantage means that people using XIM4 are always better than players on controllers. That simply isn't the case. You may be better with a XIM4 compared to using controller, but, that isn't generally true for everyone. Again, this is about what input method suits you best -- nothing more.
Get the most out of your XIM APEX, read the XIM APEX Support FAQ.

Offline TehSubXero

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Re: Kotaku: The Fight Over How To Play Ovewatch On Consoles
« Reply #29 on: 06:19 AM - 04/30/17 »
i'm so sick of this ignorant rhetoric.  don't like it? buy one.  cant afford it?  then how tf you got an elite controller, AND a scuff, a40's, and a 1ms monitor?  I can't use mnk?  alright then cancel your fios and call up at&t cuz i got 2 down 1 up and thats litterally the best speed offered in this county.  meanwhie you can order a xim to your door in rural Zimbabwe.  furthmore, if this is insta god just add mouse pad then why tf is my alt hardstuck low plat?  you write back to jeff and tell that balding fairy that what he NEEDS to do is buy my team mates xims because if i see another roadhog miss a hook on a slept enemy, i'm going to have a siezure.  that man is just upset he has a hairy back and is responsible for 3 bigfoot sightings a year when he goes to the beach.  blizzard trying to pass their aversion to the fact that a xim is a better investment than loot boxes off as concern for competetive integrity...that joke is so good they could probably sell it to kevin hart.
« Last Edit: 06:44 AM - 04/30/17 by TehSubXero »